Episode 17

Healthy or Just Trending?

🎙️ Healthy or Just Trending? – Wellness in the Age of Algorithms

Episode Summary:

Green juices. Gut gummies. “What I eat in a day.” In today’s world, wellness is everywhere—but is it helping or hurting us?

In this episode of The Mirror Project, we’re unpacking the confusing, contradictory world of health and wellness online. From body positivity to influencer culture, we’re asking: Who is wellness really for? What happens when care becomes control? And how do we reclaim health on our own terms?

🔹 The shifting definitions of health—and who gets to define them.

🔹 The rise (and fallout) of body positivity and “self-love” as content.

🔹 How social media fuels disordered messaging, toxic comparison, and curated control.

🔹 What it means to care for yourself with autonomy—not approval.

If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed by wellness trends, judged for your body, or just plain exhausted by the algorithm—you’re not alone. Let’s get into it.


🎧 Listen Now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite platform!

 

✨ What Is Health—Really?

✔️ Health has become more than physical—it’s emotional, mental, spiritual, and constantly redefined.

✔️ Wellness culture vs. healthcare—where it helps, and where it hurts.

✔️ The invisible line between self-care and obsession.

✔️ Detox teas, aesthetics-based fitness, and curated “health” on social media.

✔️ Prompt: When you scroll your feed, does “wellness” feel like support—or surveillance?

 

✨ The Double-Edged Sword of Body Positivity

✔️ The movement’s roots in body autonomy and anti-shame.

✔️ The pressure to “love your body”—and the backlash if you don’t.

✔️ Rosey Blair’s story: why she left the BOPO movement, and what it taught her.

✔️ How some influencers glamorize thinness while profiting off “acceptance.”

✔️ Prompt: Can you hold space for self-love and personal change? (We say yes.)


✨ Influencers, Algorithms & Disordered Messaging

✔️ How TikTok, YouTube, and Instagram shape our beliefs about bodies.

✔️ From “What I eat in a day” to “SkinnyTok”—why this content is harmful.

✔️ Stats that show the link between social media, disordered eating, and poor body image.

✔️ When “wellness” is just curated control—under the guise of health.

✔️ Prompt: Are we mistaking control for care?


 ✨ Reclaiming Your Own Wellness

✔️ Define what “healthy” means—for you, not the internet.

✔️ Why nuance is everything in the conversation about bodies and health.

✔️ Ask: Who profits from your insecurity?

✔️ Tips for unfollowing, unlearning, and healing your relationship with your body.

✔️ Prompt: What would care look like if it came from respect, not shame?



💡Reflections & Real Talk

✔️ Health is not a look—it’s how you feel in your skin, your mind, and your life.

✔️ You don’t owe anyone an explanation for your body or your choices.

✔️ Autonomy is a radical act—and self-trust is part of wellness too.

✔️ Balance beats perfection. And rest is productive.


🔗 Resources & Further Reading

✔️ Rosey Blair’s Post – Why I Left the Body Positivity Movement

✔️ Rosey Blair’s IG Profile

✔️ Lucy’s Viral TikTok on Self-Acceptance

✔️ Mel Robbins Podcast Episode – Food, Body Image & Truth

✔️ Emma Arletta’s IG – Honest Conversations on Wellness & Mental Health

✔️ Book: All In Her Head by Dr. Elizabeth Comen – A must-read on the medical bias women still face and how it shaped modern wellness narratives.



📲 Connect With Us!

💬 Follow us on Instagram, TikTok, & YouTube: @mirrorprojectpod

☕ Support us on Buy Me a Coffee: Support Us Here

📩 DM us your questions & topic suggestions – We’d love to hear from you!

👉 Next week’s episode: Our first guest of the season joins us to talk about her journey to becoming a published author—and why writing strong female leads for girls and women is her way of championing girl power, courage, and self-belief.

Hit that like, follow, and subscribe button, and we’ll see you next time! 🎙️✨

Transcript
Christine:

hey there.

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Welcome back to The Mirror Project.

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We're your host Christine Steam,

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Alexandra: Alexandra?

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Christine: and today we're diving

into something that's become nearly

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impossible to escape online health

and wellness, or at least what

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looks like health and wellness.

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Because somewhere between the body

positivity, hashtags, the green juices,

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the gut health gummies, and the what I

eat in a day reels, it feels like the

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conversation around health has gotten

really loud and really confusing.

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We're constantly told to love our

bodies, change our bodies, accept

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them, shrink them, nurture them,

discipline them all depending on the

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day, the algorithm or who's trending.

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So today we want to ask what does

it actually mean to be healthy?

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And more importantly, who gets to decide?

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Because for a lot of us, especially

women and people in larger bodies,

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wellness isn't always freeing.

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It can feel like another kind of

surveillance, one that dresses

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itself up as empowerment, but

often brings guilt comparison

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and pressure along for the ride.

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We're gonna talk about the shifting

definitions of health, the complicated

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legacy of the body positivity movement,

and how social media has blurred the line

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between self-care and self surveillance.

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And we'll ask some hard

but important questions.

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Can you want to lose weight

and still love your body?

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Can you opt out of the discourse entirely?

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Are we mistaking control for actual care?

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This conversation is personal,

nuanced, and probably overdue.

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So whether you're deep in your

wellness journey, questioning it all,

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or just here to listen and reflect.

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We're so glad you're here.

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Let's get into it.

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So Alexandra, I know I came to you

with this idea and it's kind of

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a mountain of a discussion, but I

feel like the two of us are just

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gonna give it our best shot today.

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And just start the conversation.

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I hope you're cool with that.

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Alexandra: Let's get into it.

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Yeah.

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Christine: Awesome.

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So why don't we start with

talking a little bit about what is

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health now and how it's received

societally, how you perceive it.

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I can get into how I perceive

it, but I feel like that's a good

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place to start this conversation.

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So let's, let me hear from you like

the evolving definition of health, from

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physical to mental, emotional, spiritual.

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What do you feel?

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What do you think?

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What is it?

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Alexandra: Sure.

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I feel like this is a, I feel

like we've been starting to

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climb up this mountain, right?

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I think last year we did a couple

episodes and I feel like this

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year we've really centered around

health and wellness on all aspects.

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I think health depends on what,

what day you're asking, right?

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Who you're asking.

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And is it a doctor?

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Is it a, a physio, is it a

is it a personal trainer?

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Like

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I,

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there really is no one

size fits all for health.

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And I think that's the biggest thing

that complicates this, whether it's

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mental health, it's physical health,

it's your emotional, like people, every

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individual has their own specific needs.

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Like, yes, I guess there are

technically ranges in which people

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should fall into and your doctor

will happily tell them to you.

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But the

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Christine: Hm.

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Alexandra: We've talked about is bullshit.

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Like, and I've had doctors like

MDs and DPS tell me, don't look at

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that, that doesn't mean anything.

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And I'm like, then why is

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Christine: Hmm mm-hmm.

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Kind of speaks to how outdated a lot

of things in the medical industry are

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and how healthcare is sort of, there's

so much in the way of trying to advance

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it, but also there's a lot of things

that are sort of stuck in years past.

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Alexandra: And I think how

information is disseminated, right?

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Christine: Mm.

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Alexandra: Like

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Christine: a long time to

clear things up sometimes.

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Alexandra: appointments

with doctors are so short.

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How is it healthcare?

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It's

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Preventative healthcare, which I know

we've talked about a lot in the past.

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I mean, we, I would love to see like

nutrition and like principles of

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nutrition and like that's, again,

nutrition is not one size fits all.

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Like I

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To see a dietician when I was in high

school and she ate a very specific way

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and she wanted a lot, seemed like she

wanted a lot of her clients to eat a

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specific way that was not working for me.

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So I felt, good enough,

never perfect enough, never

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something enough at the diet to,

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Her numbers, her metrics work for me which

was compounding a, an an eating disorder

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issue that we've talked about in the past,

which compounded self and body image and

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how I talked to myself because I wasn't

making somebody else's metrics of health.

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So it is complicated.

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I think there are some

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Levels of health, like what is

nutrient dense food, what, healthy

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habits um, and behaviors when

not done in excess or extreme.

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but it's all very, it should be

very tailored to an individual.

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And I think that's the

difficult piece, right?

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Because there's so much information

from doctors, online, influencers,

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coaches, everything coming at us.

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How do we, how do we parse it all?

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How do we, you know, we've

talked about a therapy episode.

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Sometimes it

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Christine: hmm.

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Alexandra: like dating a few

therapists, so even like, your mental

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health is not very cut and dry.

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Like, if I go

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Christine: Right,

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Alexandra: professional,

I'll get the help I need

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Christine: exactly.

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Alexandra: I feel like that was a long

answer to say who the heck knows of

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what health is today, but I think it

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Christine: Yeah.

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Alexandra: and who's

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The question.

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Christine: There's

certainly a lot of noise

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And there's a lot of people yelling

into the void and very adamantly like

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saying that their way is the right way,

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Really it is so nuanced and it is

really like dependent on the individual.

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Just real quick, I'll bring up some, I was

listening to Mel Robbins my mom actually

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shared it with me, shout out to my mom.

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Uh, she had an episode all about women's

health and how a lot of what we are

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told as women that should work for us

really is designed to work and why it,

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like, why it works out so well for men

is because our bodies are different

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in how we should approach exercise,

nutrition, all of those things.

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So just wanted to give Mel

a little shout out there.

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We can link her, her episode there

if you wanna sort of get into

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the science a little bit more.

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She had a guest on, I forget

her name, but she was wonderful.

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Um, she's a doctor I believe from

California could be wrong, but I'll, I'll

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make sure to share that with Alexandra

so we can, uh, link that for everybody.

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But

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Alexandra: Can

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Christine: I guess, yeah,

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Alexandra: I was gonna say, I think

we, we talked really interestingly

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about within the, what, past two or

three years, not to get on a side

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tangent, but for women's health,

actual, like testing of period products

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with menstrual blood versus water.

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That's a very different, how

those products work and how,

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Christine: yeah,

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Alexandra: our body cycles.

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It wasn't until I started hearing

it about it on social media that

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I learned about the LAL phase and

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Christine: follicular phase and.

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Alexandra: and you know, everything.

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And I'm like, why wasn't my

doctor telling me about this?

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Why wasn't this discussed

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Christine: My

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Alexandra: biology?

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Or

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Christine: valid

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Alexandra: with me, was it end of 2023

or beginning of:

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sleep study done only on women was, was

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Christine: Was conducted and it, yeah,

it reveals that the standard eight

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hours is well, what was based on what

works for men, but really what should

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be the average for women is 10 hours.

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So we actually need

more time for recovery.

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And it's just very eyeopening to me, like

within the last five years I've really

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begun to understand just how, when they

say like, doctors practice medicine, I.

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It is a practice.

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There is no exact, there's still learning.

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There's so much still unknown and

because it's so nuanced and because

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it affects individuals so differently

there, the symptoms you're experiencing

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can give you a list of a hundred

different potential diagnosis.

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So that is all very daunting.

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Alexandra: Yes

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Christine: so that also,

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Alexandra: symptoms.

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Christine: right.

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But it, it just sort of adds to the

noise of and I in prepping for this

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conversation was reflecting on the

correlation between the rise of wellness

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culture on social media and where the

sort of frustration has sort of grown

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within the medical system and how people's

attitudes are towards it and that.

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Realistically, it's not preventative

care were being offered.

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It's very much like after,

like af after you're

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Alexandra: sick

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Christine: de Yes.

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Thank you.

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I was trying to,

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Alexandra: people call it sick care.

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Christine: I was, uh,

struggling for the word.

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Thank you.

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So let's maybe sort of now talk

about the reflect on that, the,

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uh, a little bit more, the rise

of wellness culture and how it's

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different from traditional healthcare.

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How has this affected you, Alexandra?

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Like in terms of what

your experience has been?

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Because I know we've talked at length

about what our, um, social media

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channels are pushing towards us.

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Alexandra: Yeah, I think one, I really

like it, right, because I'm not always a

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huge fan of like western only medicine.

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Like I'm, I like a blend of

Western and eastern medicines.

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But also in wellness

practice, I think there's,

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I think a positive out of the rise of

wellness trends is that people can feel

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very empowered to take their health into

their own hands, which is sometimes need.

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When it seems like our current

medical system here in the States

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is lacking that actual preventative,

let's figure out, keep you healthy

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before you get sick kind of way.

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So I, I do like that.

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On the negative side, I will say there's

a lot of, there can be comparison, right?

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Because, we're seeing somebody and it,

and I, I know we'll get into this later in

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the conversation, but a very specific view

of what somebody's presenting on a day.

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And that's their job.

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And we can go, oh, we're

not, I'm not doing that.

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I'm not doing the same.

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I'm not doing this every day,

so therefore I'm not enough.

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And it can kind of compound some of

maybe like issues that I know I've

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had or maybe other people have had.

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Which can make it seem very trendy.

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Like our title, our episode title suggests

like that it's very, faddish oh, hey,

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listen, follow this trend, this new style.

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Christine: Yeah, exactly.

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Alexandra: Back around.

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Christine: Yeah.

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Alexandra: I think that answered

the question, but Christine,

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Christine: Yeah.

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Alexandra: what do you think,

what do you think the positives

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that have come outta this?

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there negatives?

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Do you perceive any negatives?

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Christine: Oh yeah.

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Uh, there, I think like anything

there are positives and negatives.

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Uh, just to add on a little bit

to what you were bringing up.

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'cause I agree wholeheartedly.

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Um.

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In terms of empowerment, I feel

like there has been a rise in

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people being more confident in

advocating for their healthcare.

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And I think there's countless thousands,

hundreds of thousands of millions of

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stories of people who go into doctor's

appointments and don't feel heard.

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And just how, crushing that is because

to me, to be made, to feel like it's all

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in your head or what you're experiencing

isn't really like that extreme.

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I've said before, like,

you're not living in my body.

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I am.

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And so I'm telling you how I'm

feeling, and that's not something

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to discount or write off.

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Alexandra: Or

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The conversation is rushed

'cause they're on a time crunch.

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Christine: right.

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Alexandra: fully discuss your needs.

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Christine: And on top of that

you're waiting months to have

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an appointment and then you're

in there for such a short time.

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Sometimes you're not even

with the doctor for very long.

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You're with another health

practitioner, a nurse, a nurse

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practitioner, whatever, like an aide.

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So your, your actual face time with a,

a, a doctor, a medical professional,

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um, who's supposed to have all

this knowledge is severely limited.

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Now in terms of like the negative side

like anything, I think there's a lot

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of misinformation out there, to your

point about fads and to your comparison

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about how things come back in style

with fa like in, in terms of fashion.

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I think also like a big thing is like

to make comparison to fast fashion.

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There's a lot of like fads that just show

up for a little while and then they sort

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of disappear and it's like, oh, what if,

so you really have to do your research

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into what you are considering to put

into your body or how you decide to take.

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Alexandra: Yeah.

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Christine: move.

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Yes, exactly.

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So yeah, there's a lot of

positives and negatives.

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And I think I'm a little worried these

days that the negatives are starting to

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outweigh or tip the scale a little bit,

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Which I am interested to get

more into with this conversation.

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Alexandra: Okay, so I ask a question?

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Do

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Christine: yeah,

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Alexandra: can you talk about what you

think about the line between self-care

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obsession within the context of wellness?

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Christine: so I think there's really

telling data out there that is becoming,

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to make itself prevalent in terms of like.

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This idea, these ideas of like

wellness and self care and it's

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effectively like a way to control your

environment yourself, those around you.

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And that anything in that

extreme, I think lends itself

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to an addiction and obsession.

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You're constantly chasing something

and it becomes your whole focus.

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So it's a very fine line.

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And I do agree that's, that's an invisible

one, and it's one to just be mindful of.

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And I, I find immense help in finding

community, talking with friends, family.

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I know a lot of people also

find help in support groups.

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My dad is a part of a couple of

different ones related to his struggles

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with Lyme chronic Lyme disease.

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So, I think like my worry comes to.

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When it comes to that is like,

don't isolate yourself with within

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this experience and this journey

because doing it alone can get scary.

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What, what about you, what do you

think in terms of the self care and

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obs the line between that in obsession?

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Alexandra: I think it, it

definitely can be a fine line.

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And, uh, going back to, was it

a conversation last week or the

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week before about like, rituals,

rule the outcomes or habits?

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And I think health is a habit, right?

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in,

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Christine: Absolutely.

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Alexandra: choosing our health

individually, what that means for you.

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Christie may be able to eat, wheat and

gluten, and I may not be able to, so

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that health would look differently.

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So making a choice in a habit, like I

could, if I had an issue with gluten

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and I wanted to push through it, I could

just eat gluten or I could say, Hmm, I

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need to change my habits around this.

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So that, I think there is a level of

discipline when it comes to health

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that is necessary and self-care, right?

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Because we talked about sometimes

not prioritizing our own self-care,

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Makes us more tired.

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So that does take a level of discipline,

which is, which is good, right?

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Like discipline in that you're

doing self-care for yourself, you're

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taking care of your health and

whatever the way that looks like.

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But yes, it can, I think,

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bleed quickly for some individuals,

myself included, into obsession, if not.

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Moderated, if not particularly with

the influx of everything that we're

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seeing on social media and prete.

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Perhaps if you feel like feelings

of like not enough or comparing

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yourself too much, then it can very

quickly devolve into obsession and,

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Hyper control, which is then almost

detrimental to your care health in many

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Christine: Absolutely.

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Yeah, definitely.

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Alexandra: yeah, it's a line to ride.

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Christine: oh, for sure.

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And I think that lens really nicely into

this next sort of point I'd like to dive

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into a bit more, and that's the idea

of trends versus truth and what social

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media is selling is health, like detox,

teas, gut health, gummies aesthetic based

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fitness, like all those sorts of things.

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how does that sort of feed, we can

go deep into how that feeds into

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this obsession or how that affects

people's mental health and their day

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to day, how they view themselves.

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What do you, what are some

of your thoughts on that?

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Alexandra: I like how you said

it can feed into it, right?

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Like it can it trip on those insecurities

that we have of like, our life doesn't

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look this way, or our health isn't

as aesthetic as this person's online,

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which can then, if you're somebody

again, comparison is where you kind

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of are central, then that devolves

your, your journey or whatever.

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But also I think it's um, they're

quick fixes and quick fixes.

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In my opinion and experience.

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I have tried many do not

work for long-term health.

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Christine: In some cases they

like make it twice as hard

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Alexandra: yep.

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Christine: move forward.

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Alexandra: Now with some of like the detox

to use or help, like there are foods and

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things that have natural, like properties

in them that help with certain things.

338

:

And

339

:

Christine: Sure.

340

:

Alexandra: moderation is key.

341

:

And I think this is kind of where it

goes back to our individual bodies

342

:

for some individual the gut gummies

may fix their gut for another person

343

:

it may not because that might not be

their underlying issue or concern or

344

:

what's in that may not work for them.

345

:

So I think a lot of it requires critical

thinking, out what is being sold to us.

346

:

If you try it and it works for you, great.

347

:

If you try it and it doesn't work

for you, then don't get discouraged.

348

:

Like I

349

:

The biggest thing.

350

:

Christine: Yeah.

351

:

Alexandra: and that is the hardest

part with a lot of this, right?

352

:

Because you said there's so much noise,

there's so many people saying that

353

:

this is the one right way, this is

the right way, this is, and this is

354

:

aesthetic and you can do it this way.

355

:

Christine: Yeah.

356

:

Alexandra: it's so much trial and error.

357

:

Christine: Is so much

trying to Yeah, exactly.

358

:

So much trial and error and you

have to really dig in on it and

359

:

See the, because a lot of

this stuff, especially like.

360

:

The detox teeth, the gut health companies,

like, there's not really science

361

:

backing up a lot of these products.

362

:

And you, you just gotta do like

even a little digger of a deep

363

:

dive in on some of these things.

364

:

I'm not talking about hours of your

time, but if you're just going off of

365

:

like face value of listening from one

person, like just dig a little deeper

366

:

and it could be just like five extra

minutes to just sort of see like,

367

:

okay, this is what this person says.

368

:

Is there anybody else talking about this?

369

:

I mean, good old Reddit, you can

spend, you can do a deep dive of

370

:

hours on end on certain things,

but the information's out there.

371

:

Um, and I know I suffer from this too,

the thought of like, ugh, trying to

372

:

find the right, uh, the right thing

through all the noise seems daunting,

373

:

but just take a couple extra minutes

and maybe, maybe it could really

374

:

transform what you choose to do.

375

:

Alexandra: I will say on the trends

aspects, sometimes if you look at the

376

:

slower moving trends within fitness and

health, you can, I think that's where we

377

:

can see like really positive aspects of

the rise of wellness, of moving your body.

378

:

Almost every day or like daily,

you know, I think there are

379

:

Christine: Yeah.

380

:

Alexandra: things that you can build

long-term habits around in a community.

381

:

Like, I like what you said,

going back to the community.

382

:

Like I think that is a trend that's come

out of the, the wellness is that more

383

:

people are willing to create communities

around health, wellness, fitness and

384

:

whatever variety that works for you.

385

:

Christine: Yeah,

386

:

Alexandra: think that's

a, that's a positive.

387

:

That's come and that's a wonderful trend.

388

:

And maybe not, or truth,

you know, that it's

389

:

Christine: sure.

390

:

Alexandra: It's proving the test of time,

391

:

Christine: definitely.

392

:

To sort of finish out this section

of the conversation, I have a prompt

393

:

that I wanna throw out there to you,

Alexandra, but also to those listening.

394

:

I want you all to think

about this for a little bit.

395

:

When you are scrolling your feed, how

often does wellness feel more like a

396

:

performance than something helpful?

397

:

Alexandra: I'm excited 'cause I know

that later in the conversation we're

398

:

gonna talk about more about social media,

but I'd say right now on average, I,

399

:

it can seem like a lot of the wellness

content that is created by hundreds

400

:

of creators can be posturing or very

401

:

Based.

402

:

I would say that was certainly true for

what was coming through my feed, maybe

403

:

a year and a half ago, two years ago.

404

:

I would say that I've worked.

405

:

Hard on, like critically thinking

about and considering what I'm

406

:

consuming visually and auditorily

to curate like who I'm following,

407

:

unfollowing people that were maybe

408

:

Of those very performative and starting

to follow more people who are like,

409

:

Hmm, this is my life, this is my body.

410

:

This is what I'm doing.

411

:

Or like some coaches who have a bit more

of a moderate approach who talk about the

412

:

science, who maybe buck with tradition,

but they still have some of that

413

:

discipline who kind of, you know, give

credence to eating how you need to eat

414

:

because again, there's no one right way.

415

:

So I would say I follow kind of a

mix of individuals, um, from like

416

:

personal trainers to coaches to like

people who talk about nutrition in,

417

:

and, and I would describe them as

more authentic, at least for me.

418

:

I like the ones who specifically

talk about the ups and downs

419

:

of wellness and fitness and.

420

:

I feel like her name is Olivia fit.

421

:

I don't remember her handle.

422

:

But I know I've mentioned her

in a past episode, so I might be

423

:

able to go find her in her notes.

424

:

And she talks about like, this is

my body today and this is my body.

425

:

Yesterday, I didn't do

anything differently.

426

:

And it's just, this is like the down

sometime of this, and she actually

427

:

talks about like some of the mental

health stuff in terms of being like

428

:

a content fitness, health creator.

429

:

So

430

:

Like that approach.

431

:

That's my answer for

432

:

Christine: I think that's a, I think

that's a great great way of looking at it.

433

:

I know for me the biggest telltale sign

of sort of like the posturing or, or, uh,

434

:

The performance, excuse me, aspect of, of

wellness on social media is when they're

435

:

always, when there's like this element

of use of them selling something to you,

436

:

Know, it's like clearly they're being

paid to put this on their platform, to

437

:

put this in front of their audience.

438

:

And I think there's some merit to that.

439

:

I think especially I've, I've found some

creators on online and in this space

440

:

that offer up some great resources.

441

:

And, but you, you just

gotta be careful too.

442

:

Be mindful, be just self-aware of

what they're pushing you and re

443

:

and, and just keep that head on your

shoulders of like, this is not reality.

444

:

This is one person's, the sort of

vis like vision of their life they're

445

:

putting out there for you to see.

446

:

And in a lot of, in a lot of cases,

this is their job, so they're able

447

:

to curate their life around this, and

that's not the case for everybody.

448

:

So I think that also feeds can feed

into like the inadequacy or the, the,

449

:

uh, struggle people feel in terms

of like, ah, I'm never good enough.

450

:

I'm never gonna like,

give yourself some grace.

451

:

Like my big thing.

452

:

Um, this year we've, we've talked about

that a lot is just give yourself grace.

453

:

Don't give up on yourself.

454

:

Reach out, into your, your network

and, and find a community where you

455

:

feel seen and like, don't find yourself

isolated because that's never good.

456

:

Alexandra: Oh, well, okay.

457

:

So I feel that that leads nicely into

another part of the conversation.

458

:

I think that is also.

459

:

Kind of what started this for us when

we were thinking about month's episodes.

460

:

So let's dive into the double-edged

sword that can be body positivity.

461

:

So

462

:

Christine: Hmm,

463

:

Alexandra: what good has come

from the body positivity movement?

464

:

Christine: Ooh.

465

:

I think a lot of good has come out of it.

466

:

I think there is been this sort of push

towards just acceptance of like beauty

467

:

at any size and that one size fits all,

sort of like idea standard of beauty.

468

:

Is not real.

469

:

And so I think at its core it's

helped a lot of people feel

470

:

less shame around their bodies.

471

:

We've seen a move towards accept, like

I said, accepting your body at any size.

472

:

So that's sort of what I, I think

has been a big positive that's come

473

:

from the body positivity movement.

474

:

I ha.

475

:

But you know, and I'm excited to

get into this more, I've been on a

476

:

journey, um, myself of how I feel about

the body positivity movement and its

477

:

drawbacks and where I sort of find

myself today in terms of all of that.

478

:

So.

479

:

Alexandra: Okay.

480

:

Well, can you talk a little bit about

that, the struggles that you've had

481

:

with the body positivity movement

and some of those challenging

482

:

feelings that you've just discussed.

483

:

Christine: Sure.

484

:

Totally.

485

:

So there's definitely a pressure,

I think that has just been slowly

486

:

building, uh, around this idea of

loving your body at every size.

487

:

And while that at face value is

a really nice sentiment, I think

488

:

that can sometimes backfire.

489

:

And I think it's important to

acknowledge that nothing's perfect.

490

:

Especially something that at face

value could, with positivity in the

491

:

name, could actually have some pretty

heavy, um, negative issues that pop up.

492

:

And I think also just to remember that the

movement is, it's been, it was born out of

493

:

like this uproar from individuals living

in bodies that society didn't label ideal.

494

:

So naturally, like we're kind of going

towards the extreme end, other end of

495

:

the spectrum and everything should just

be kind of taken with a grain of salt.

496

:

That's kind of like how I.

497

:

I find myself settling into this today.

498

:

I don't know, Alexandra, if you

like, what your thoughts are.

499

:

I know, like I, I sort of as a bigger

person think a lot about about this a lot

500

:

and trying to come to, to just terms with

accepting who I am and where I'm at now.

501

:

But enough about me.

502

:

Do you have anything to add?

503

:

Alexandra: No, I don't.

504

:

I think we talked about it on the episode.

505

:

The two part episode from first part of

last season, so that was a while ago.

506

:

But, I absolutely hated the body

positivity movement, mostly because like,

507

:

I have been so negative about my body.

508

:

That it, yeah, somebody sitting there

telling me that I should love myself

509

:

at this highest that I clearly hated,

did not resonate with me, did not work.

510

:

And I can see that the pressure that

you're talking about, like feeling

511

:

forced to have to like yourself, to

love yourself at the, at where you

512

:

are, that you should be proud of it.

513

:

And you're like, but I'm clearly,

like, for me, I was clearly struggling

514

:

with feelings of like, no, I don't.

515

:

Christine: Yeah.

516

:

Alexandra: Um, so, I know we talked

about in one of our sayings in

517

:

mantras episodes, but like, you can't

shout at yourself in the mirror.

518

:

You can't, and in this context, you can't

hate yourself into a body that you love.

519

:

You can't force, to me, you can't

force something that isn't there.

520

:

And I think it takes time and,

yeah, I just, um, so I didn't

521

:

really engage with it a whole lot

when I first heard it, it was like

522

:

this is not for me.

523

:

Christine: yeah.

524

:

No, I get that.

525

:

Alexandra: so antithesis

to what I was feeling.

526

:

Christine: Yeah, it definitely, when

I first started to become aware of

527

:

it, I finally, I sort of fe felt a

sense of, oh, finally I'm being seen.

528

:

Finally I'm being allowed been given

the permission to celebrate like where

529

:

I am and in the body I'm in currently.

530

:

And what sort of, if I may like, add

to, to my earlier points what sort of

531

:

lended to this sort of evolution in

terms of how I sort of see the movement.

532

:

And it's not like I've, I completely

it, but I think I've definitely

533

:

moved more towards an area of body of

body acceptance and just remembering

534

:

that it's something to constantly

like work towards and work at.

535

:

Because on any given day you can feel

totally different about your body.

536

:

But what really helped put this

into perspective for me was a.

537

:

Content creator I follow on Instagram.

538

:

Her name's Rosie Blair.

539

:

She goes by Rosie Beam on Instagram.

540

:

She did a really interesting

visual essay on Instagram.

541

:

It's very very detailed and,

and goes pretty in depth.

542

:

And, um, I'll make sure that we link

that for everybody in the show notes.

543

:

But just to give a little insight,

what the key points of what she

544

:

basically was sharing are she

herself is a plus size woman.

545

:

And when she found the body positivity

movement on Tumblr, actually that,

546

:

you know, like many people she felt

seen and then, Instagram was born,

547

:

um, the body positivity movement or

BOPO moved over to Instagram and she.

548

:

Joined the plus size fashion influencer

following on Instagram and started

549

:

celebrating her body publicly the first

time became and has become quite an

550

:

influential influencer on Instagram, and

that's, that's where her root started.

551

:

However, go ahead.

552

:

Alexandra: I was gonna say, I, I will

say I appreciated that out of the body

553

:

positivity movement is that we did

start to see women, particularly of

554

:

different body shapes and sizes that

was being presented in traditional media

555

:

rise.

556

:

And I think that's beautiful.

557

:

Christine: yes.

558

:

Alexandra: should clarify my point

earlier of like, no, I hated it

559

:

Christine: No,

560

:

Alexandra: of me mentally,

561

:

Christine: totally.

562

:

Alexandra: No, but

563

:

Christine: Yeah.

564

:

Alexandra: to see that.

565

:

Now we're starting to see, bodies

of all shapes and sizes, heights and

566

:

weights, and I think that's, that was so

important and such a, a huge movement.

567

:

So that's so cool that she was able

to almost in at the ground floor

568

:

being an influencer in that sphere.

569

:

I.

570

:

Christine: Totally.

571

:

And once she was in it, she was loving it.

572

:

She really found a

community of great support.

573

:

However, she started to sort of

see the underbelly once she was

574

:

in it, and she goes in depth in

this visual essay that she posted.

575

:

She quickly learned that talking about

intentional weight loss was off limits.

576

:

She goes in depth about how she had plus

size influencers who she looked up to and

577

:

had been following for forever, like DMing

her and saying, you should take down your

578

:

posts and, basically after, and this was

all, this all came out of her being quite

579

:

vulnerable and sharing her desire to lose

some weight because she had quit her job.

580

:

Just to give a little background

if you don't have time to look at

581

:

her post, she had quit her job was

focusing on content creation full time.

582

:

So she was home working on a computer.

583

:

And she worked at a call center, I

believe, to just help make ends meet

584

:

while she was building her platform

and had gained some significant weight.

585

:

And so she reached a point where

she wanted to open up and be vulner

586

:

vulnerable about talking about intentional

weight loss, and really was not well

587

:

received and basically had this intern

and internalized the message of never

588

:

talk about weight loss, just don't,

589

:

Alexandra: Okay.

590

:

Christine: is, which.

591

:

A lot to unpack there.

592

:

So she goes on to say like, as the body

positivity move became trendy brands, saw

593

:

money and started to opt in basically what

was happening was with this rise of the

594

:

body positivity movement, other people

were coming into the picture, mid-size

595

:

bodies, women who had just given birth

and were like living in a new, a post

596

:

pregnancy body like, and this idea of body

positivity, loving yourself at any size

597

:

started to shift away from the original

sort of core audience of the movement.

598

:

And, also behind the scenes when she

was going to these different creator

599

:

events was being pushed like this

idea of liposuction in certain areas

600

:

to make yourself more appealing while

still maintaining this body positivity

601

:

image, which is so contradictory if

we really stop to think about it.

602

:

And so she saw the double standard

curves are good, but only curated once.

603

:

she goes more into this deeper

into this really sort of, starts

604

:

to question a lot of things here

around the toxic policing within the.

605

:

Body positivity community.

606

:

She, she's witnessing bullying

and scrutiny of other plus

607

:

size creators who lose weight.

608

:

The pressure to conform kept

her silent even as her own

609

:

health and mobility declined.

610

:

And she began to question, if

this movement claims to be about

611

:

autonomy, why doesn't it allow me

to make choices about my own body?

612

:

So she reaches a tipping point and she's

like, I need to find an exit strategy.

613

:

So she does a couple of things.

614

:

She stops using body positivity,

hashtags or claiming space and movement.

615

:

She no longer aligned with, she

shifts her content because she

616

:

still has quite a big following.

617

:

And I think I, I remember like looking

back on this, I, I sort of, sort of

618

:

started to see how she started focusing

less on her body and was more focused on

619

:

lifestyle, hobbies and inclusive fashion.

620

:

So she was promoting brands that

wasn't just exclusively plus size.

621

:

Clothing, but it was brands

that offered both straight

622

:

size and plus size and therapy.

623

:

Man, boy was it helpful, like I

think the two of us here can also

624

:

agree therapy is is super helpful.

625

:

So with this realization, she finally

reaches a point to open up and tell her

626

:

community about the journey she's been on.

627

:

So she finally shares her her

intention to lose weight and

628

:

eventually pursue weight loss surgery.

629

:

And she was mocked by creators that she

once called her friends and her peers.

630

:

and then she had this aha moment, um,

and realized many influencers profit

631

:

from clapping back at others, even under

the guise of protecting the community.

632

:

Which.

633

:

One, when I was reading through this

again, I was, I was doing some reflection.

634

:

I was like, yeah, you know what,

there is a lot of, I see a lot of that

635

:

within the community of, um, creators.

636

:

I may have followed at one time, sort of

doing a clap back video of like, they'll

637

:

do a snip pit snippet of, um, like a video

or something of them criticizing something

638

:

in particular, and then they'll go in

in depth and clap back, as one will say.

639

:

And she, she quickly understood

that this wasn't for her.

640

:

Like this was her realization.

641

:

This wasn't about discourse, it was about

creating content and thus making money.

642

:

So the bigger questions are

643

:

no one's, these are the things, sorry.

644

:

So the bigger questions she

sort of comes to realize are no

645

:

one's mad at you losing weight.

646

:

It's how you talk about it.

647

:

Which is a standard no one can meet.

648

:

So whether you stay silent

you're seen as hiding.

649

:

Whether you speak up, you're seen

as being a bully or being harmful.

650

:

So it's really just a double edged

sword, no matter what way you spit it.

651

:

And also why must she was questioning

why must her relationship with

652

:

her body be defined at all?

653

:

Our feelings fluctuate.

654

:

Our bodies change and labels

I agree, feel too restrictive.

655

:

So here are our last two, two points.

656

:

One, this next section's

about autonomy and aesthetic.

657

:

Autonomy is greater than aesthetic.

658

:

She'll be one, she'll be the first to

say like, she doesn't hate her body.

659

:

She sim she simply wants to

care for it on her terms.

660

:

And she red and she rejects that.

661

:

I, she rejects the idea that weight

loss is inherently disordered and

662

:

says it can also be an active agency.

663

:

Choosing weight loss surgery

isn't giving into fat phobia.

664

:

It's reclaiming the right to

decide what's best for her life.

665

:

And she ends by saying something

very, very eloquent is which

666

:

is, I hope you believe yourself.

667

:

I hope you believe yourself.

668

:

I hope you trust yourself.

669

:

It took me forever to do what I needed

and I'm so glad I did, which I encourage

670

:

you who may be listening to this episode.

671

:

Thank you for hearing my TED talk,

but it was just such an eye-opening.

672

:

Explanation as to how she feels about a

community that she once was a part of.

673

:

And I think it raises some really,

really tough questions about,

674

:

honestly, a community that has kind

of an identity crisis at times.

675

:

Like, it doesn't really know

what it's in support of.

676

:

Like, it's like any, on any given day,

it can be like over here or over there.

677

:

And I don't wanna necessarily say

like the body positivity movement

678

:

is bad and should not exist

because it has done so much good.

679

:

But I think like you need

to look at anything you need

680

:

to look at it critically.

681

:

And I hope that you take the time

to sort of think for yourself.

682

:

Like there were a lot of things

within what she was saying.

683

:

I agree with.

684

:

And.

685

:

I just encourage others

to do the same, so,

686

:

Alexandra: I think that the

thing I found interesting is like

687

:

you are talking about weight loss,

and that's an autonomy choice, right?

688

:

Like whether you want to, for

whatever reason, lose weight.

689

:

That's a personal choice.

690

:

And part of me wants to say, fuck

anyone who doesn't, you know who,

691

:

who doesn't get it, and people won't.

692

:

And I think that's the hard thing, right?

693

:

Sometimes, like we as people, like we

look at creators and I think creators

694

:

kind of maybe fall into the trap.

695

:

Like she said, she was her,

the wool pulled back from her

696

:

They're putting out content.

697

:

Their life is in some ways open

for public consumption, and people

698

:

are gonna be shitty no matter what.

699

:

Christine: Yeah.

700

:

Alexandra: like you said, like

you, you lose weight or, and you

701

:

don't talk about it, you're hiding.

702

:

If you talk about it, then you're,

you know, you're being harmful.

703

:

And unfortunately, there's gonna

be people who are always unhappy.

704

:

And to me, I wanna say fuck them.

705

:

And that's something I'm trying to work

on myself, like, fuck other people's

706

:

opinions about what I need to do

707

:

And believe myself or, you know, if

you need other people need to do that.

708

:

I thought it was really

interesting that she was getting

709

:

such flack for that choice.

710

:

Particularly when she said she

had health and mobility issues.

711

:

And to

712

:

Christine: Yeah.

713

:

Alexandra: like health can often,

and sometimes include losing weight

714

:

Reason,

715

:

It's heart health, whether it's

but maybe it's just moving your bo

716

:

being able to move your body and

like, why is that such a bad thing?

717

:

Why do people have

718

:

Fucking problem if other people say

they wanna move their body more easily?

719

:

Christine: yeah

720

:

Alexandra: I'm so

721

:

Christine: a hundred percent.

722

:

Alexandra: rating on our podcast,

but like, fuck off people.

723

:

Like honestly

724

:

Christine: Yeah.

725

:

Well, it's almost like, um, it,

it really sort of shed No, yeah.

726

:

It sheds a light onto how much,

727

:

it almost, I feel like what

happens is people like wrap up

728

:

their identity in this person that

they follow online, a celebrity,

729

:

an influencer, whoever it may be.

730

:

And once they make a choice for

themselves, for the person who

731

:

is the follower of them, I think

what hap what really it comes down

732

:

to is they feel betrayed, which I

don't unders understand completely

733

:

because you are not owed anything

734

:

From these people.

735

:

And.

736

:

Why do you feel like you have any sort

of you should, you can have any sort of

737

:

opinion on what a person chooses to do for

their body, for their health, for their

738

:

mental health, for their like it just was

so disheartening to hear basically she

739

:

was scared because her livelihood was tied

up in this and she was, she was already

740

:

criticized for trying to be vulnerable and

741

:

share how she was feeling.

742

:

Like physically she was

struggling to move her body and

743

:

Alexandra: And that's a

quality of life thing, right?

744

:

A, to,

745

:

Christine: So it's like you're gonna

make, you're gonna force people into

746

:

like sacrificing their quality of life

just so you feel better about yourself.

747

:

Let's take a moment and rethink

748

:

Alexandra: I'd be

749

:

Christine: maybe.

750

:

Alexandra: thing to talk to like

a therapist about like attachment

751

:

Public figures.

752

:

I feel like I've listened to somebody

on social media talk about it.

753

:

Maybe the guy, professor Neil, I'd have

to go back and try and find it, but

754

:

like why people have that attachment.

755

:

Interesting that you're

saying they feel betrayed.

756

:

And I also wonder, it's if somebody

they follow is choosing to make a

757

:

choice okay, we're gonna call, just

need to think of some names here.

758

:

'cause I feel like I'm gonna

start saying they too much.

759

:

It's gonna get confusing.

760

:

Okay.

761

:

So Jane is an influencer and Jane

is like, I am doing this for my way.

762

:

I'm going to choose to eat this

specific diet because that's what

763

:

my doctor and I think works for

me and wow, it's working and okay.

764

:

And somebody else is over there

like, well I like the way you used

765

:

to eat and I used to eat that way.

766

:

And now I'm that person.

767

:

The follower Joe is being confronted

with the fact that, maybe they need

768

:

to look at their life and how they're

eating and seeing somebody that they

769

:

looked up to change their life is either

going to help them go, Hmm, okay, I see

770

:

somebody else doing it, maybe I can do it.

771

:

And then maybe other times

it's like, I just wanted.

772

:

I'm trying to think of word

that you saw said earlier.

773

:

I wanted permission

774

:

Christine: Hmm.

775

:

Alexandra: to be the way exactly

that I am without having to change.

776

:

And so seeing somebody they follow

change might feel like suddenly call

777

:

into their identity into question.

778

:

Christine: Yeah.

779

:

Yeah,

780

:

Alexandra: I hope that made sense.

781

:

Christine: it does.

782

:

And I think, I think what can even

sort of add to this con this argument

783

:

or conversation even more is another.

784

:

Bear with me.

785

:

Everybody is another.

786

:

There's another post I came across,

which I forget who it was a TikTok post.

787

:

Let me see who the creator was.

788

:

Um, Lucy by Yoga, sorry, Lucy

b Yoga and it, I don't know

789

:

where the audio originated from.

790

:

She used the audio over a video of hers.

791

:

But essentially it goes

into how bigger bodies.

792

:

There's this like, and I alluded to it

earlier, this surveillance of being in a

793

:

larger body, living in a larger body means

your body is constantly being watched

794

:

and it's being policed and evaluated,

and most of the time, weight loss is

795

:

prioritized and, and praised above.

796

:

Sorry, I'm getting a call.

797

:

I don't know who you are,

so I'm gonna decline.

798

:

And as a result, weight loss is

what is prioritized and praised

799

:

a above all other achievements, a

pers a a bigger person may achieve

800

:

in their life, which is really sad.

801

:

And which is why I think a lot of people

found so much solid like safety in the

802

:

body, positivity movement at first because

it was giving them permission to just

803

:

like accept their body where they were at.

804

:

But on, on this idea of surveillance,

805

:

people in, in a bigger body

806

:

basically suffer from other people feeling

entitled to comment on how they look, what

807

:

they eat, and how they live their life.

808

:

Even from loved ones who believe this

scrutiny is a form of care, enforcing

809

:

reinforcing it under the guise of love.

810

:

And there's this assumption that

811

:

Fat people are always try trying or

should be always trying to lose weight.

812

:

And that body changes are automatically

inter interpreted as a success

813

:

or a failure with no regard for

context, like why you may be

814

:

gaining weight or losing weight.

815

:

And as Rosie was getting into

her post and comes up in this,

816

:

is there's this loss of autonomy.

817

:

And that plus size people are taught that

they owe an explanation for their bodies.

818

:

And that the idea that their and

that there's this idea that their

819

:

bodies are public domain is.

820

:

Is so deeply ingrained and

often goes unquestioned.

821

:

So

822

:

this post sort of ends with this

affirmation of boundaries and the speaker

823

:

just shares like, bodies are not community

property, and we owe no one explanations,

824

:

approval or permission to exist.

825

:

So

826

:

how it, it was so interesting how these

two posts came to me and like I, and

827

:

in reflecting a little bit more on how

these two may relate or, or like the

828

:

main theme that both of these, these,

um, posts are, are sharing, it's like

829

:

this illusion of a this illusion of

empowerment in online wellness spaces

830

:

And the hidden rules and contradictions

that really are harmful for people.

831

:

Both of these post challenge the

idea that body positivity or body

832

:

scrutiny is really about care.

833

:

And they reveal how both society

at large and supposedly progressive

834

:

communities still uphold harmful

expectations about plus size bodies.

835

:

They both speak to the emotional

toll of being a body that others feel

836

:

entitled to monitor, judge, and define.

837

:

And ultimately they reclaim the idea

that true health, wellness and self-love

838

:

cannot exist without bodily autonomy.

839

:

And I hope that those listening find

comfort in what we've shared here today.

840

:

We have a lot more to dive into, but,

uh, those are the two things I really

841

:

was, uh, very adamant about sharing.

842

:

And I hope it comes across

like I bring this up.

843

:

Just with all the love and respect

in the world to everybody who

844

:

have their own opinions on things.

845

:

But I think it's an important

conversation that we have.

846

:

So my question after all of this,

to those listening to you, Alexandra

847

:

and I will also answer this,

848

:

can we hold space for both

self-acceptance and personal change?

849

:

Alexandra: Yes, I think we can, and that's

not an answer I would've given a year ago.

850

:

I think a desire to change

any aspect of yourself.

851

:

If it comes from a place of I hate

X about something, I dislike X about

852

:

something it shouldn't be this from,

you know what society's saying, I

853

:

don't know that it'll ever last.

854

:

The changes will, I don't know

that they will be permanent because

855

:

they not seem rooted in a place.

856

:

Now, I'm not saying like

somebody, you wanna change,

857

:

you're fed up with your situation.

858

:

I feel like often I've said that you have

to hit your rock bottom in order to like.

859

:

the motivation, discipline to change

whatever you're, you want to do.

860

:

And through that, you don't have to

immediately jump to, you know, loving

861

:

the thing that you hate about yourself.

862

:

But there is, I think along the

way, the acceptance of where you're

863

:

at and from that place, making

the changes that you want for,

864

:

I don't wanna say a better

reason, that's not right.

865

:

For a more sustainable reason will help

you get to like accepting where you're

866

:

at, but also wanting to change at the same

867

:

Christine: Hmm.

868

:

Alexandra: and being able to appreciate

the work that you've done along the way

869

:

and say, wow, look at how far I've come.

870

:

Christine: Absolutely.

871

:

Alexandra: So Christine, do you

think that they can coexist or

872

:

are they mutually exclusive?

873

:

Christine: I think they are,

they, I think they can coexist.

874

:

I think it, it takes a lot

of work to get to that point.

875

:

I think what I struggle with a lot

around this whole conversation is

876

:

why does body positivity, like why do

I have to choose between being body

877

:

positive and being fit and healthy?

878

:

Like why can't, why does it

have to be one or the other?

879

:

So

880

:

Alexandra: It

881

:

Christine: I, I,

882

:

Alexandra: Well, That's

883

:

Christine: I agree, and I think

it's because both sides of the

884

:

coin may feel threatened by the

other, but I don't know why there

885

:

has to be this sort of antagonistic

feeling between the two ideas.

886

:

Because IFI, and we've talked about

this curating who were following online.

887

:

And be, and feeling free to follow

or unfollow creators that in,

888

:

or celebrities that no longer

align with how you're feeling.

889

:

There's one person in who makes me feel

really seen on Instagram, and she's on

890

:

TikTok too, and she has a YouTube channel.

891

:

Um, and I've talked about her before.

892

:

Emma Aletta, she's a plus size influencer,

but she recently ran, I believe it

893

:

was a half marathon in New York City,

and she documented her training.

894

:

She's apl uh, she's a plus size

Pilate instructor where she teaches

895

:

Pilate once a month out in California.

896

:

And she actively shares her health,

wellness and fitness journey with

897

:

her audience and shows that like fat

girls plus size girls can be fit too.

898

:

And there's a, there's, there needs

to be a better conversation around.

899

:

Health and fitness and how it

looks for each individual person.

900

:

So I realize I kind of got away from

the question, but my answer is yes, I

901

:

believe you can hold space for both.

902

:

And I think, uh, it's journey

and it takes time to get there.

903

:

But if you work hard and if you

surround yourself with the right

904

:

people, it is, um, it is possible.

905

:

Alexandra: I wanna add something

made me think while you were

906

:

talking about, you said Emma Arleta

907

:

Christine: Yes.

908

:

Alexandra: and the need to see.

909

:

Showcase, maybe just have it become more

normal, like seeing people at different

910

:

stages of their fitness, and I remember

who I follow or what her name is, but

911

:

she was stitching part of a video that I

think it was at like a CrossFit gym and

912

:

somebody was doing like all these pull-ups

and then this, the next woman comes up.

913

:

Um, I think it was maybe a man or

a woman first, and then it was her.

914

:

And she is like maturing at

the gym is realizing I can't

915

:

do that, but let me scale back.

916

:

And I

917

:

Like, this is some, I think that is

the thing that kind of can help make

918

:

bridge the, can those both coexist

still with work absolutely hard with

919

:

hard work is taking your ego out of it

920

:

I think health fitness can be the most

humbling journey that you've ever been on.

921

:

Christine: Yeah.

922

:

Alexandra: And it takes

so much fucking patience.

923

:

Um, like the assumption or like

the, the expectation that results

924

:

will come quickly, I think for

me has been a major pitfall.

925

:

So taking your ego out of it because

you see somebody on social media

926

:

that you admire and respect doing

something, you may not be there,

927

:

but you can absolutely get there

through patience and application.

928

:

And I think that's where

929

:

was something you were saying about

both sides being threatened, right?

930

:

Because then if somebody

finds a way to bridge the two,

931

:

Christine: Yeah.

932

:

Alexandra: people

933

:

might be required to work on

themselves in a way that they

934

:

haven't wanted to commit to,

935

:

Christine: Hmm.

936

:

Alexandra: and maybe they want to.

937

:

But maybe they just haven't

done it yet, so I don't know.

938

:

Or they're just afraid

because it's unknown.

939

:

Because what would that look like?

940

:

would it look like if more people

bridged that and succeeded there?

941

:

Because I feel like we've talked about

it before, humans, like Division I,

942

:

Christine: Humans like division,

humans like labels, humans like boxes.

943

:

Alexandra: and

944

:

Christine: And I

945

:

Alexandra: to straddle

946

:

boxes or labels is very threatening.

947

:

Christine: I'm, I, and I may get

some flack for this eventually.

948

:

I'm very much like the opposite.

949

:

Why do I, why does there

need to be a label?

950

:

Why can't I just be me?

951

:

Why can't I just be like

honest about, Hey, I'm just a

952

:

girl trying to figure it out.

953

:

One day I feel this way.

954

:

The next I can feel completely

different and wanna be over here.

955

:

And that's okay.

956

:

Yeah.

957

:

Just because I say one thing

doesn't mean I have to be beholden

958

:

to that for the rest of my life.

959

:

I am a human who evolves and changes.

960

:

Alexandra: And that makes me wonder, like

961

:

with body positivity or, and I

know we've talked about in other

962

:

context of other conversations,

wrapping your identity up only in

963

:

one aspect of yourself, I feel like,

964

:

can be a dangerous way

to pigeonhole yourself.

965

:

Get sucked into the label

because then that is your label.

966

:

That is exactly what

you've defined yourself as.

967

:

And it makes it hard to branch out and

then therefore have those days where you

968

:

feel different today versus tomorrow.

969

:

And have that be accepted or

respected by, I don't know.

970

:

I feel like that's,

971

:

yeah.

972

:

If we wrap up our indemnity

only one aspect of who we are,

973

:

Christine: Yeah.

974

:

Alexandra: we are denying.

975

:

The possibility of integrating all

those things and saying, oh, I do

976

:

this and this and this, and oh,

977

:

Christine: yeah, definitely.

978

:

Alexandra: On that note, I feel like we

have been dancing around the subject.

979

:

Let's get into influencers,

algorithms, and disordered messaging.

980

:

Christine: Let's do it.

981

:

Alright.

982

:

Take it away.

983

:

Alexandra: All right.

984

:

So how do you think media platforms

like TikTok, Instagram, YouTube,

985

:

young people's, but even I think

at this point, all different age

986

:

ranges, beliefs about health?

987

:

Christine: I think it

has a huge impact on it.

988

:

It's what controls the space.

989

:

It's where a lot of people get

their information, get their get

990

:

their news, get their history.

991

:

Like it, it is what rules rule today and

992

:

it makes me feel nervous.

993

:

I think that, and something we'll get

into here are the numbers and the research

994

:

a little bit that we've done into how

that has impacted not well young people

995

:

especially, but everybody mentally most,

I think is the biggest take home, how

996

:

this has all affected them mentally.

997

:

So you and I, we grew up in the

early two thousands, late nineties,

998

:

early two thousands, and boy oh

boy, it wasn't pretty then either.

999

:

Why I'm so fucked up.

:

00:57:10,717 --> 00:57:14,257

And Alex, you, uh, Alexandra, you

can share how it has fucked you up.

:

00:57:14,697 --> 00:57:18,297

Was the glamorization and

glorification of disordered eating

:

00:57:18,391 --> 00:57:28,161

And heroin chic and just this really

unhealthy, um, view on what beauty

:

00:57:28,161 --> 00:57:35,481

was and how it had significantly

fed into disordered eating.

:

00:57:35,721 --> 00:57:39,231

And it largely affected young women,

but it does affect men as well.

:

00:57:39,420 --> 00:57:41,280

Um, and non-gender conforming people.

:

00:57:42,219 --> 00:57:45,699

Alexandra: And I'm guessing that

the numbers reported for males

:

00:57:45,699 --> 00:57:50,139

and non-gender conforming, um,

people are grossly under-reported.

:

00:57:51,013 --> 00:57:56,713

Christine: I, yes, I definitely struggle

to find some more background into that,

:

00:57:56,713 --> 00:57:59,053

but that's where we're coming from.

:

00:57:59,053 --> 00:58:00,073

But now, today

:

00:58:00,262 --> 00:58:00,592

Alexandra: Oh.

:

00:58:00,763 --> 00:58:01,693

Christine: faced with.

:

00:58:02,233 --> 00:58:05,533

The what I eat in a day

culture, and boy oh boy.

:

00:58:05,533 --> 00:58:08,563

Let's sort of talk about

how problematic that is.

:

00:58:09,172 --> 00:58:13,612

Alexandra: Before we jump into it, I

just have to say this, um, past weekend,

:

00:58:13,612 --> 00:58:16,042

I recently re, re-watched Clueless.

:

00:58:16,267 --> 00:58:18,277

Christine: I love clueless, but oh boy,

:

00:58:18,706 --> 00:58:20,116

Alexandra: yeah it's fun.

:

00:58:20,116 --> 00:58:21,556

It's a cute movie,

:

00:58:21,672 --> 00:58:22,182

Christine: can't be.

:

00:58:24,256 --> 00:58:30,736

Alexandra: much like the film, the

TV from that era, like the way in

:

00:58:30,736 --> 00:58:37,066

which particularly young girls eating

and teenagers is so normalized and

:

00:58:37,066 --> 00:58:38,806

she was like, oh, I feel so fat.

:

00:58:38,806 --> 00:58:41,566

I've had two Mochaccinos

and I've been bad today.

:

00:58:41,566 --> 00:58:41,806

Right?

:

00:58:41,806 --> 00:58:42,406

Like, first of

:

00:58:42,492 --> 00:58:43,932

We're just labeling something.

:

00:58:43,932 --> 00:58:47,802

And then she was something about carbs

later in the movie and I'm just like, oh,

:

00:58:48,162 --> 00:58:50,832

this is partially why I am so fucked up.

:

00:58:50,882 --> 00:58:51,947

'Cause that was a fun movie.

:

00:58:52,593 --> 00:58:52,883

Christine: Yeah.

:

00:58:53,027 --> 00:58:53,657

Alexandra: a cute movie.

:

00:58:53,657 --> 00:58:55,757

It's a great retelling

of Jane Austen's, Emma,

:

00:58:56,448 --> 00:58:57,528

How they talk about food.

:

00:58:57,798 --> 00:59:00,773

But it just made me think of

that 'cause I just re-watched it.

:

00:59:01,794 --> 00:59:04,824

Christine: That's honestly

really how appropriate.

:

00:59:06,133 --> 00:59:09,283

But, but if you don't mind, let's

dive in a little bit and talk about

:

00:59:09,343 --> 00:59:11,113

today, what we're facing today.

:

00:59:11,173 --> 00:59:15,823

The why I eat, excuse me, the what I eat

in a day culture and why it's problematic.

:

00:59:15,992 --> 00:59:22,112

I have seen not only the continued rise

of disorder, like eating disorders,

:

00:59:22,112 --> 00:59:27,992

like anorexia, bulimia, I've also sort

of seen this rise in binge eating.

:

00:59:28,702 --> 00:59:32,332

And I think, thinking back to how we

grew up, the idea of like the clean

:

00:59:32,332 --> 00:59:39,082

bait, the clean plate club, and today

we have like the accessibility to

:

00:59:39,082 --> 00:59:40,972

food, thanks to food delivery apps.

:

00:59:42,952 --> 00:59:47,032

I really wanted to sort of

analyze how that was contributing

:

00:59:47,032 --> 00:59:49,492

to binge eating, overeating.

:

00:59:49,952 --> 00:59:55,772

The, I started seeing on my TikTok feed

this Tiffany plate, which Alexandra

:

00:59:55,772 --> 00:59:59,522

just watched for the first time and was

like, why the hell is this woman eating

:

00:59:59,552 --> 01:00:01,712

mustard and cottage cheese on everything?

:

01:00:01,871 --> 01:00:04,091

Alexandra: I also feel like I should

preface that I'm not a huge fan

:

01:00:04,091 --> 01:00:06,011

of the texture of cottage cheese.

:

01:00:06,011 --> 01:00:08,591

So that was what kind of really

gave me the ick about that.

:

01:00:08,681 --> 01:00:11,231

And kept dipping everything

:

01:00:11,642 --> 01:00:12,902

Christine: Everything?

:

01:00:13,541 --> 01:00:13,991

Alexandra: to her.

:

01:00:13,991 --> 01:00:14,861

That's what she likes.

:

01:00:15,761 --> 01:00:16,451

Enjoy it.

:

01:00:17,441 --> 01:00:18,221

I'm not gonna watch it.

:

01:00:18,221 --> 01:00:21,086

I'm gonna choose that to,

with the Tiffany plate.

:

01:00:21,992 --> 01:00:22,532

Christine: Yes.

:

01:00:23,312 --> 01:00:28,197

And we've fair enough, my friend, I scroll

through it, scroll right by it now too.

:

01:00:28,197 --> 01:00:31,767

It's not for me, but if it's

for you, I support that.

:

01:00:31,797 --> 01:00:34,167

Do what makes you feel good.

:

01:00:34,617 --> 01:00:39,287

But we and as we've talked about in this

episode the idea of like influencer life

:

01:00:39,287 --> 01:00:42,227

versus average per the average Joe's life.

:

01:00:42,291 --> 01:00:47,751

And I mean we can even tie this

back to our, and as you have so have

:

01:00:47,751 --> 01:00:51,831

already, our conversations are about

that we had about habits and rituals.

:

01:00:52,641 --> 01:00:57,531

I just wanna share with y'all

some stats that I found.

:

01:00:57,651 --> 01:01:00,801

Let's first start with social

media and how that's affected.

:

01:01:00,801 --> 01:01:04,041

Disorder eating, excuse me,

and how that has affected,

:

01:01:05,955 --> 01:01:06,515

Alexandra: Defected.

:

01:01:06,545 --> 01:01:06,835

Okay.

:

01:01:07,461 --> 01:01:10,071

Christine: I don't know where

that came from and how that

:

01:01:10,071 --> 01:01:12,231

has affected disordered eating.

:

01:01:12,321 --> 01:01:12,891

So

:

01:01:15,501 --> 01:01:19,731

nearly half of teens, ages 13 to

17 say social media makes them

:

01:01:19,731 --> 01:01:21,171

feel worse about their bodies.

:

01:01:22,326 --> 01:01:27,276

Teens are spending three plus hours a day

on social media platforms and are twice

:

01:01:27,276 --> 01:01:29,616

as likely to develop an eating disorder.

:

01:01:31,456 --> 01:01:37,846

It's been reported that 49% of Instagram

users following health food accounts,

:

01:01:37,846 --> 01:01:40,426

exhibit anorexia nerv symptoms.

:

01:01:40,530 --> 01:01:46,350

Around 46 to 80% of young people

report body dissatisfaction in dieting

:

01:01:46,350 --> 01:01:50,760

behaviors, even at a normal weight,

which I think is really interesting.

:

01:01:51,510 --> 01:01:55,900

Also some other, some other

facts here, some other data here.

:

01:01:57,430 --> 01:02:02,350

Among one sample of college

students, 52% of girls and 45% of

:

01:02:02,350 --> 01:02:05,050

boys show disordered eat in eat.

:

01:02:06,460 --> 01:02:07,330

Let's take that back.

:

01:02:10,255 --> 01:02:16,285

Among one sample of college students,

52% of girls and 45% of boys showed

:

01:02:16,345 --> 01:02:20,665

disordered eating behaviors like

restrictive eating or excessive exercise.

:

01:02:22,555 --> 01:02:24,960

And then there was a, do I have a point

:

01:02:25,324 --> 01:02:30,354

Alexandra: Yeah, I was gonna say both of

those symptoms seem to are very closely

:

01:02:30,354 --> 01:02:36,589

tied to orthorexia, which is a newer

class of newer classification of nervosa.

:

01:02:36,979 --> 01:02:37,099

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:02:37,373 --> 01:02:40,793

Alexandra: tied to like obsession

with restrict, can be restricted

:

01:02:40,793 --> 01:02:44,863

eating, but obsession with seemingly

healthy foods or exercise in

:

01:02:44,863 --> 01:02:47,173

combination to an obsessive amount.

:

01:02:47,503 --> 01:02:52,723

So I, and it's so interesting that

that's at the college age, right?

:

01:02:52,783 --> 01:02:53,563

Like I feel like

:

01:02:53,649 --> 01:02:53,769

Christine: hmm.

:

01:02:55,739 --> 01:03:00,663

It's, it's the point where, look, you're

18 years old, you're out on your own.

:

01:03:00,663 --> 01:03:00,874

You're not.

:

01:03:01,904 --> 01:03:04,699

You, you don't have your, the

support system around you that

:

01:03:04,699 --> 01:03:06,049

you had since you were a kid.

:

01:03:07,069 --> 01:03:11,254

So you can be heavily

influenced and it, it's scary.

:

01:03:12,214 --> 01:03:17,974

And, and I just have a couple of other,

uh, other stats here I wanna share.

:

01:03:18,214 --> 01:03:25,274

There is also a study of youth aged

ages 14 to 25 that found that 42% had

:

01:03:25,274 --> 01:03:29,834

probable eating disorders and 41.7%

:

01:03:29,834 --> 01:03:32,684

were classified as social

media addicted, which is

:

01:03:32,793 --> 01:03:33,543

An addiction.

:

01:03:33,653 --> 01:03:38,423

We also, that could be a whole nother

episode topic or multiple episode topic.

:

01:03:38,903 --> 01:03:44,033

The social media addiction

significantly correlated with

:

01:03:44,033 --> 01:03:46,313

bulimia and food preoccupation.

:

01:03:47,672 --> 01:03:48,002

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:03:49,013 --> 01:03:51,913

Christine: And lastly, we've talked

a lot about how this has affected,

:

01:03:52,123 --> 01:03:54,553

uh, youth and young adults.

:

01:03:55,438 --> 01:03:58,618

This even affects middle

aged women, ages 40 to 63.

:

01:03:58,688 --> 01:04:06,698

There has been high rates, 89% who

use social media and social comparison

:

01:04:06,698 --> 01:04:11,168

on platforms was strongly linked

to bulimia, dietary restraint,

:

01:04:11,168 --> 01:04:13,028

and other eating pathology.

:

01:04:15,272 --> 01:04:15,957

There's a lot there.

:

01:04:18,146 --> 01:04:20,006

Alexandra: I feel like that could

be a whole other conversation

:

01:04:20,006 --> 01:04:23,276

about aging language around aging,

:

01:04:23,587 --> 01:04:26,917

Particularly for women

that we could get into.

:

01:04:26,917 --> 01:04:28,842

But I think.

:

01:04:30,637 --> 01:04:37,567

Part of me is surprised by the, the

almost 90% of women in that study

:

01:04:37,867 --> 01:04:41,297

that were affected by this like, and

written it, written out in our notes.

:

01:04:41,327 --> 01:04:44,987

It's kind of shocking, but at the same

time I'm like, I'm actually not surprised

:

01:04:45,638 --> 01:04:50,138

The language in which society

talks about middle aged and

:

01:04:50,249 --> 01:04:50,609

Christine: Yeah.

:

01:04:51,458 --> 01:04:52,658

Alexandra: particularly for, anyways,

:

01:04:53,249 --> 01:04:55,349

Christine: No, it's, it's a great point.

:

01:04:55,349 --> 01:04:58,519

And I wanna throw one other thing

in our show notes that lends

:

01:04:58,519 --> 01:04:59,929

nicely to this conversation.

:

01:04:59,929 --> 01:05:03,649

If you wanna get into the science a

bit more about specifically around

:

01:05:03,649 --> 01:05:05,829

women and the the healthcare system.

:

01:05:06,249 --> 01:05:08,079

I'm listening to a book right now.

:

01:05:08,079 --> 01:05:11,859

I think I brought it up once before, but

I'm actually getting into it finally.

:

01:05:12,279 --> 01:05:13,689

It's called All In Her Head.

:

01:05:14,129 --> 01:05:19,499

It's written by, let me

double check one second.

:

01:05:24,809 --> 01:05:26,189

It's all in her head.

:

01:05:26,249 --> 01:05:29,999

The Truth and Lies Early Medicine

taught us about women's bodies

:

01:05:29,999 --> 01:05:31,979

and why it matters today by Dr.

:

01:05:31,979 --> 01:05:32,969

Elizabeth Koman.

:

01:05:33,418 --> 01:05:34,378

I'm only.

:

01:05:35,698 --> 01:05:38,608

13% of the way through,

like almost two hours in.

:

01:05:39,058 --> 01:05:44,358

But it is a really interesting it's given

me a lot of interesting history into

:

01:05:46,938 --> 01:05:51,408

the healthcare system and how it

has treated women specifically.

:

01:05:51,957 --> 01:05:52,227

Alexandra: Okay.

:

01:05:52,437 --> 01:05:52,707

Yeah.

:

01:05:53,096 --> 01:05:55,557

I have a, sorry, brain

:

01:05:56,708 --> 01:05:57,183

Christine: It's okay.

:

01:05:57,687 --> 01:05:58,257

Alexandra: at the moment.

:

01:05:58,647 --> 01:06:00,596

I'm, I would be curious to listen to that.

:

01:06:00,596 --> 01:06:01,877

So I might check that out.

:

01:06:01,877 --> 01:06:09,127

Next is a book I have started but have

not finished in, um, check that out

:

01:06:09,373 --> 01:06:11,293

As a attrition.

:

01:06:11,573 --> 01:06:15,970

Who experienced any sort of disordered

eating and to the point of like where you

:

01:06:15,970 --> 01:06:19,720

start ignoring your body's actual cues.

:

01:06:19,990 --> 01:06:24,250

I only made it through like the three

first four or five chapters, and from

:

01:06:24,250 --> 01:06:29,115

that point I did find it very helpful

to rework, rewire those patterns.

:

01:06:29,815 --> 01:06:30,205

Christine: Awesome.

:

01:06:30,325 --> 01:06:33,445

We'll be sure to include both of those

in the show notes for you guys if

:

01:06:33,445 --> 01:06:34,915

you're interested in checking them out.

:

01:06:34,975 --> 01:06:39,685

I have a couple of more stats to share,

uh, some on food delivery apps and how

:

01:06:39,685 --> 01:06:44,695

that correlate correlates with disordered

eating, as well as some stats around

:

01:06:45,175 --> 01:06:50,795

the emergence of skinny talk, which

is becoming quite trendy right now.

:

01:06:50,795 --> 01:06:53,404

And the muck bang, muck, bong trend.

:

01:06:53,465 --> 01:06:54,035

Excuse me.

:

01:06:54,035 --> 01:06:54,095

So.

:

01:06:56,225 --> 01:06:59,945

I was really interested in wanting to

see if there was any sort of data out

:

01:06:59,945 --> 01:07:05,075

there about the correlation between

food delivery apps like Uber Eats,

:

01:07:05,105 --> 01:07:11,345

DoorDash, GrubHub, and how that has

contri contributed to eating disorders,

:

01:07:11,345 --> 01:07:13,145

specifically binge eating disorders.

:

01:07:13,835 --> 01:07:17,375

There wasn't a whole, there isn't a

whole lot out there yet, but from what

:

01:07:17,555 --> 01:07:23,855

I was able to find, there was a study

using ecological momentary assessment

:

01:07:24,785 --> 01:07:34,025

or EMA with 483 participants, 79% women

that showed food delivery app users

:

01:07:34,025 --> 01:07:38,585

had significantly greater urges to

overeat, especially when experiencing

:

01:07:38,585 --> 01:07:45,075

negative moods and loneliness,

which I think I've shared a couple

:

01:07:45,075 --> 01:07:47,355

of times before on, on the podcast.

:

01:07:47,415 --> 01:07:53,025

Um, sort of my sort of, uh, struggle

with food is like the idea of.

:

01:07:54,600 --> 01:07:55,590

It brings me com.

:

01:07:55,620 --> 01:07:58,860

Like I, I believe, like

it brings me comfort.

:

01:07:58,920 --> 01:08:03,300

And so sometimes that leads to me

making not the best choices for myself.

:

01:08:03,750 --> 01:08:09,490

So it makes sense to me that this

is what this study sort of showed.

:

01:08:09,900 --> 01:08:17,520

And also 70% of GrubHub users, many

being young adults report ordering

:

01:08:17,520 --> 01:08:20,130

calorie rich fast food via delivery apps.

:

01:08:20,130 --> 01:08:23,910

And 84% of frequent users

were most likely to live with

:

01:08:23,910 --> 01:08:27,149

obesity, and 45% were overweight.

:

01:08:27,359 --> 01:08:35,590

So with the, uh, ease these

platforms give users now, it really

:

01:08:35,590 --> 01:08:37,630

just, it's feeding into the issue.

:

01:08:37,870 --> 01:08:43,819

And I'm a little nervous with

how that can have a, a long-term

:

01:08:43,819 --> 01:08:48,109

impact on eating disorders.

:

01:08:49,970 --> 01:08:55,050

And finally some data, uh, around

some stats around the emergence of

:

01:08:55,050 --> 01:08:57,090

Skinny Talk and the Muk Bong trend.

:

01:08:57,690 --> 01:09:02,010

There's been a recent trend called

Skinny Talk on TikTok, that glamorizes,

:

01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:04,410

extreme thinness and restrictive eating.

:

01:09:04,410 --> 01:09:06,615

It's like we're back

in:

:

01:09:06,759 --> 01:09:08,649

Alexandra: Yeah, I was about

to say, I was like, wow.

:

01:09:08,649 --> 01:09:11,349

Flashbacks to high school, middle school.

:

01:09:11,408 --> 01:09:12,249

Oh my gosh.

:

01:09:12,404 --> 01:09:12,694

Christine: Yeah.

:

01:09:12,879 --> 01:09:14,769

Alexandra: the fashion trend of skinny

:

01:09:15,125 --> 01:09:15,415

Christine: Yeah.

:

01:09:15,510 --> 01:09:19,410

It's back in fashion and

it's been directly linked to

:

01:09:19,410 --> 01:09:23,940

increasing eating disorder cases

and has promoted call, sorry.

:

01:09:24,944 --> 01:09:29,475

And it has been linked to increasing

eating disorder cases and has

:

01:09:29,665 --> 01:09:34,345

prompted calls from a advocacy

groups for better in intervention.

:

01:09:34,495 --> 01:09:36,354

I don't know why I can't talk today.

:

01:09:36,535 --> 01:09:37,194

Forgive me.

:

01:09:38,705 --> 01:09:43,375

And lastly I just wanna sort of touch

on the, because very trendy has been

:

01:09:43,375 --> 01:09:47,944

for many years, the m bong videos

which if you are somehow not familiar,

:

01:09:48,365 --> 01:09:53,434

uh, is where, is where hosts eat

large quantities of food on camera.

:

01:09:53,934 --> 01:09:59,105

And that has been associated with viewers

binge contributing to binge eating

:

01:09:59,105 --> 01:10:01,955

urges and problematic eating behaviors.

:

01:10:03,089 --> 01:10:09,089

So let's sort of take a moment to

digest all of that and maybe we can

:

01:10:09,089 --> 01:10:10,829

like, reflect on here in a little bit.

:

01:10:10,939 --> 01:10:16,099

What this all sort of like

means for us, how it impacts us.

:

01:10:16,204 --> 01:10:16,424

So

:

01:10:25,533 --> 01:10:28,143

Alexandra: I think if you're, me

personally, food and I will always

:

01:10:28,143 --> 01:10:29,613

have an interesting relationship.

:

01:10:29,973 --> 01:10:34,743

So not surprised that I'm not

familiar with mucking content

:

01:10:35,024 --> 01:10:37,814

Would trigger a few things for me.

:

01:10:38,834 --> 01:10:40,754

'cause while I did have anorexia.

:

01:10:41,039 --> 01:10:45,639

I did ha struggle with some bingeing

which is, and also disordered

:

01:10:45,639 --> 01:10:46,929

eating is very interesting.

:

01:10:46,929 --> 01:10:50,789

Like just I wanna go back to

one of the first things you

:

01:10:50,789 --> 01:10:53,519

mentioned in this section, which

was like the clean play club.

:

01:10:53,725 --> 01:10:57,200

I don't think people realize, on

one second, turn on the light.

:

01:11:01,573 --> 01:11:06,783

I don't think people can realize

that their parents saying clean your

:

01:11:06,783 --> 01:11:08,343

plate before you can have dessert.

:

01:11:08,343 --> 01:11:11,973

Or Make sure you clean your plate of

everything like that can, something as

:

01:11:11,973 --> 01:11:14,763

simple as that can lead to disordered

eating in the sense that it's

:

01:11:14,763 --> 01:11:19,143

telling you to overwrite your body's

natural cues of when you're full.

:

01:11:20,433 --> 01:11:23,993

And I think that is something

so dangerous like teaching young

:

01:11:23,993 --> 01:11:26,273

individuals to ignore their body's cues.

:

01:11:26,633 --> 01:11:29,753

And I, I don't know if we've really talked

about it on the podcast before, but I'd

:

01:11:29,753 --> 01:11:32,243

really like to see a massive overhaul.

:

01:11:32,273 --> 01:11:35,813

So like the education system, and one

of the few, the areas that I would

:

01:11:36,202 --> 01:11:41,833

like to see massive change around

is understanding health our body's

:

01:11:41,833 --> 01:11:46,623

health and the varied ways that can

show up for different individuals.

:

01:11:48,573 --> 01:11:52,593

better understanding around phys

ed, like actual, like body movement,

:

01:11:52,593 --> 01:11:56,873

body mechanics muscle groups,

like to best move your body.

:

01:11:56,873 --> 01:12:00,713

Things like mobility, focusing on that

stuff at younger ages and teaching that.

:

01:12:00,713 --> 01:12:02,033

And then nutrition,

:

01:12:02,549 --> 01:12:06,959

Is information about nutrition, having

that actually talked about and discussed

:

01:12:06,959 --> 01:12:10,929

so people can figure out what, how

they can listen to their body and feed

:

01:12:10,929 --> 01:12:13,539

their body the nutrition they need.

:

01:12:16,599 --> 01:12:17,229

'cause I just,

:

01:12:17,355 --> 01:12:18,225

Christine: I am on board, babe.

:

01:12:21,804 --> 01:12:26,154

Alexandra: I think I'm very lucky in some

ways to, to be so comfortable talking

:

01:12:26,154 --> 01:12:29,904

about my experience with, you know, food

and eating disorder because I hope that

:

01:12:30,774 --> 01:12:34,034

else out there who maybe has struggled

with a similar eating disorder or a

:

01:12:34,034 --> 01:12:39,584

different one will find comfort and can

feel like they can maybe talk about it

:

01:12:40,034 --> 01:12:40,154

Christine: Hmm,

:

01:12:40,663 --> 01:12:42,763

Alexandra: and maybe heal

from some of that stuff.

:

01:12:43,513 --> 01:12:43,753

'cause it

:

01:12:43,764 --> 01:12:47,274

A journey and it is a process and

I, is so disheartening to hear

:

01:12:47,274 --> 01:12:54,414

that disorders are back on the

rise at such staggering statistics.

:

01:12:56,124 --> 01:13:00,894

And it's not even just eating disorders,

but disordered eating in different habits

:

01:13:00,894 --> 01:13:03,054

and it's things associated around food.

:

01:13:04,215 --> 01:13:04,535

Christine: Absolutely.

:

01:13:07,375 --> 01:13:08,895

I, I,

:

01:13:14,370 --> 01:13:14,910

I am worried.

:

01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:16,380

I definitely think like.

:

01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:21,900

My, my sort of takeaway from all of

this is, is I'm worried but of what

:

01:13:22,110 --> 01:13:25,350

this can all sort of spiral into.

:

01:13:25,410 --> 01:13:30,420

But I think I do have hope in that regard

of like, us having conversations like

:

01:13:30,420 --> 01:13:36,150

this where we are speaking up and sort

of sharing some info and just having

:

01:13:36,150 --> 01:13:38,650

the conversation could do a lot of good.

:

01:13:38,860 --> 01:13:39,820

At least I hope so.

:

01:13:41,254 --> 01:13:41,544

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:13:42,490 --> 01:13:43,180

Christine: And

:

01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:46,150

let's see.

:

01:13:46,150 --> 01:13:46,660

I'm just sort of

:

01:13:49,180 --> 01:13:52,540

think a little bit more about what,

what else we wanna touch on in

:

01:13:52,540 --> 01:13:54,760

this section of the conversation.

:

01:13:54,760 --> 01:13:55,270

I think

:

01:13:57,309 --> 01:14:02,290

if anything, this has sort of

helped me realize that there

:

01:14:04,660 --> 01:14:08,830

are some really dangerous

comparisons and hidden harm.

:

01:14:09,364 --> 01:14:14,044

That is disguised as a well, like

in under the guise of wellness

:

01:14:14,044 --> 01:14:17,304

influencing or wellness influencers.

:

01:14:18,954 --> 01:14:24,684

And I think the more we talk about

this, like we are here today, the

:

01:14:24,684 --> 01:14:28,674

more we share our own personal

stories, it can hopefully just like

:

01:14:31,193 --> 01:14:34,614

help someone out there listening

know that they're not alone.

:

01:14:34,614 --> 01:14:38,544

That there are two people right

here who will gladly sit down

:

01:14:38,544 --> 01:14:40,764

and chat this out with you.

:

01:14:41,214 --> 01:14:46,124

I think the, the more we can sort

of, I dispel this idea of like,

:

01:14:46,424 --> 01:14:50,384

this isn't something we should talk

about it, it can hopefully only

:

01:14:53,114 --> 01:14:58,034

help and not harm, but I think we

have to be intentional about how we

:

01:14:58,034 --> 01:14:59,684

go about the conversation, which.

:

01:15:00,503 --> 01:15:01,223

Alexandra: Absolutely.

:

01:15:01,943 --> 01:15:03,952

I think that leads nicely into like

:

01:15:06,833 --> 01:15:13,343

my unsolicited advice is to, for

people to critically think about

:

01:15:13,403 --> 01:15:15,923

the content that you're consuming.

:

01:15:16,643 --> 01:15:20,273

Visual content from social media,

auditory content from social

:

01:15:20,273 --> 01:15:23,783

media, music, tv, movies, anything.

:

01:15:24,173 --> 01:15:30,952

Be okay using the unfollow the movies,

anything or align with unsubscribe

:

01:15:30,952 --> 01:15:32,603

buttons for people who no long

:

01:15:33,239 --> 01:15:36,209

Time to see if you insult or attack on us.

:

01:15:43,745 --> 01:15:43,825

Christine: hmm.

:

01:15:47,125 --> 01:15:47,545

Attack.

:

01:15:48,775 --> 01:15:49,065

Yeah.

:

01:15:50,068 --> 01:15:51,989

Alexandra: exercise your right to unfollow

:

01:15:52,415 --> 01:15:53,945

Knows, maybe their content will shift.

:

01:15:53,945 --> 01:15:55,775

Exercise your right to unfollow.

:

01:15:56,015 --> 01:15:59,555

I think that is someplace

where we can see and consume

:

01:16:04,055 --> 01:16:06,184

in a way that is beneficial for us.

:

01:16:06,635 --> 01:16:06,905

Christine: Yeah,

:

01:16:09,959 --> 01:16:10,259

Alexandra: yeah.

:

01:16:10,684 --> 01:16:11,015

Christine: agreed.

:

01:16:13,265 --> 01:16:13,895

I think that

:

01:16:15,359 --> 01:16:15,749

Alexandra: Yeah,

:

01:16:15,845 --> 01:16:16,565

Christine: very well put.

:

01:16:19,318 --> 01:16:23,989

Alexandra: Zoom and see it the stuff

we can about ourselves, to ourselves

:

01:16:23,989 --> 01:16:25,999

and think about, I like this person.

:

01:16:29,710 --> 01:16:30,320

Christine: Extremely.

:

01:16:31,800 --> 01:16:31,920

I

:

01:16:34,489 --> 01:16:38,074

Alexandra: I wanna hear more

from them or, Ooh not anymore.

:

01:16:39,505 --> 01:16:40,345

Christine: thank you for your time.

:

01:16:40,345 --> 01:16:42,175

I'm going to exit stage left.

:

01:16:43,234 --> 01:16:43,594

Alexandra: Yes.

:

01:16:43,594 --> 01:16:45,784

And we don't have to leave nasty comments.

:

01:16:45,964 --> 01:16:46,084

We

:

01:16:46,135 --> 01:16:48,684

Christine: Think before

you comment people look, I.

:

01:16:51,025 --> 01:16:55,375

I've said this before, I very much

am above the mind of you treat

:

01:16:55,375 --> 01:16:56,905

others the way you wanna be treated.

:

01:16:57,145 --> 01:17:00,145

If you wouldn't say to their

face, don't comment it.

:

01:17:00,259 --> 01:17:01,099

Plain and simple.

:

01:17:01,969 --> 01:17:02,929

Hugs and kisses.

:

01:17:05,089 --> 01:17:05,568

Mm-hmm.

:

01:17:05,809 --> 01:17:07,339

From, from my heart to yours.

:

01:17:09,418 --> 01:17:09,898

Alexandra: okay.

:

01:17:10,628 --> 01:17:13,298

I see in our notes here, you

have another prompt for us.

:

01:17:13,559 --> 01:17:14,309

Christine: Oh boy.

:

01:17:14,699 --> 01:17:16,619

I do like my prompts today.

:

01:17:20,699 --> 01:17:21,568

So I

:

01:17:23,939 --> 01:17:26,469

let's all I pose this to all, to you all.

:

01:17:27,219 --> 01:17:32,379

Do we, are we mistaking

curated control for health?

:

01:17:33,618 --> 01:17:36,053

Alexandra: Since it's interesting that

we're using the word curated again,

:

01:17:36,374 --> 01:17:36,594

Christine: Yes.

:

01:17:37,073 --> 01:17:41,723

Alexandra: it can, it could be

both in a positive or negative

:

01:17:41,924 --> 01:17:42,794

Christine: Another negative.

:

01:17:43,104 --> 01:17:46,044

I definitely, I think absolutely.

:

01:17:46,044 --> 01:17:46,584

Yes.

:

01:17:46,654 --> 01:17:49,023

And it's extreme, of course.

:

01:17:49,094 --> 01:17:52,874

Which I do find at times

we are heading that way.

:

01:17:54,374 --> 01:17:55,124

And

:

01:17:57,674 --> 01:18:00,604

I think it's a way for people

to control their environment.

:

01:18:00,708 --> 01:18:05,148

And if there's one thing I have

learned in my self, in my journey

:

01:18:05,148 --> 01:18:11,573

to, to self-awareness and care, that

can often do more harm than good.

:

01:18:11,733 --> 01:18:15,483

Sometimes you just need to let things

be, uh, you can only control so

:

01:18:15,483 --> 01:18:17,643

much, you can't control other people.

:

01:18:18,273 --> 01:18:19,803

Of course, protect yourself.

:

01:18:20,523 --> 01:18:22,563

Be there for yourself, take care of you.

:

01:18:23,973 --> 01:18:26,523

But you can't always

control, control thing.

:

01:18:28,257 --> 01:18:28,587

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:18:30,733 --> 01:18:31,723

Christine: What are your takeaways?

:

01:18:31,723 --> 01:18:32,858

What do you think about that prompt?

:

01:18:34,537 --> 01:18:37,827

Alexandra: So, I think my philosophy

is everything in balance or harmony.

:

01:18:38,688 --> 01:18:38,768

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:18:39,867 --> 01:18:40,107

Alexandra: like I,

:

01:18:40,208 --> 01:18:40,327

Christine: I,

:

01:18:40,557 --> 01:18:43,057

Alexandra: I'm trying to work

towards for my own life as well.

:

01:18:43,987 --> 01:18:50,047

overacting control and can

absolutely call it curated of food.

:

01:18:51,832 --> 01:18:55,552

Your body image, the body image

you think you should have.

:

01:18:56,002 --> 01:19:02,392

Fitness can be very detrimental

if it's under the guise of health

:

01:19:02,392 --> 01:19:05,087

unquote, so I would agree with

you, Christine, in the extreme.

:

01:19:07,427 --> 01:19:08,087

So harmful.

:

01:19:10,877 --> 01:19:16,157

Conversely, on the other side, when

we talked about rituals and habits,

:

01:19:16,997 --> 01:19:23,877

a specific or a moderate level of

discipline and control can, can help

:

01:19:24,357 --> 01:19:28,827

you achieve your health goals, for a

:

01:19:28,963 --> 01:19:29,202

Christine: Absolutely.

:

01:19:30,447 --> 01:19:31,017

Alexandra: life.

:

01:19:31,377 --> 01:19:35,357

Before we move on to the next section, you

had talked about something about dieting.

:

01:19:35,662 --> 01:19:39,017

One of the statistics, the numbers

about dieting at normal weights.

:

01:19:39,633 --> 01:19:39,853

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:19:39,873 --> 01:19:40,323

Alexandra: Habits.

:

01:19:40,683 --> 01:19:46,623

Um, and I think from my own journey

and even seeing a lot of the

:

01:19:46,623 --> 01:19:50,493

health and wellness, I mean, it

does tend, I feel like, to skew

:

01:19:50,493 --> 01:19:51,933

very much towards weight loss.

:

01:19:51,933 --> 01:19:56,733

And I think that's probably because

many people are somewhere on the

:

01:19:56,733 --> 01:19:59,657

journey of losing weight for whatever

reasons or whatever motivation.

:

01:20:00,093 --> 01:20:00,273

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:20:01,107 --> 01:20:05,067

Alexandra: I've always struggled with

a diet culture and I have definitely

:

01:20:05,067 --> 01:20:08,937

tried a lot of the fad, like three day

diets, lose 10 pounds, never worked.

:

01:20:09,117 --> 01:20:09,597

Is,

:

01:20:13,197 --> 01:20:15,927

and I think this goes back to

something I was trying to, to get at

:

01:20:15,927 --> 01:20:19,377

earlier and trying to articulate and

I did, I don't know that I did well.

:

01:20:20,457 --> 01:20:24,027

Whatever your goal for change

is, if that's you wanna be

:

01:20:24,027 --> 01:20:26,967

healthy, think clearly defining,

:

01:20:29,666 --> 01:20:30,502

you know what I'm gonna hold.

:

01:20:31,332 --> 01:20:33,012

this has gotta be cut into the next part.

:

01:20:33,762 --> 01:20:34,182

I'm gonna hold that.

:

01:20:35,073 --> 01:20:35,373

Christine: Okay.

:

01:20:35,562 --> 01:20:35,772

Alexandra: Okay.

:

01:20:36,582 --> 01:20:37,002

Sorry.

:

01:20:37,332 --> 01:20:38,022

Where is it going?

:

01:20:38,172 --> 01:20:40,302

'Cause I just looked at it

like with section four title.

:

01:20:40,842 --> 01:20:42,492

was like, oh, Alexandra, hold on.

:

01:20:42,492 --> 01:20:42,972

Two seconds.

:

01:20:43,332 --> 01:20:43,842

All right.

:

01:20:44,202 --> 01:20:49,302

So I think that brings us to our

last section of today's episode.

:

01:20:49,302 --> 01:20:51,791

It's been quite a lengthy

one, so thank you.

:

01:20:52,242 --> 01:20:53,082

So

:

01:20:53,108 --> 01:20:53,327

Christine: Yes.

:

01:20:53,412 --> 01:20:53,652

Alexandra: think

:

01:20:53,682 --> 01:20:53,952

Christine: for hanging in.

:

01:20:54,771 --> 01:20:58,741

Alexandra: now that'll be for everyone

for sticking around, what is health today?

:

01:20:59,701 --> 01:21:00,661

own health

:

01:21:13,021 --> 01:21:14,221

and our own wellness.

:

01:21:14,311 --> 01:21:20,071

So Christine, how do you

learn what health is for you?

:

01:21:20,161 --> 01:21:22,381

Not some algorithm that's

being pushed to you?

:

01:21:23,341 --> 01:21:24,601

Our own health.

:

01:21:25,681 --> 01:21:26,791

Not clearly articulate.

:

01:21:27,421 --> 01:21:28,741

How do you figure out

:

01:21:38,527 --> 01:21:39,666

What health and wellness is for you?

:

01:21:43,183 --> 01:21:44,743

Christine: It takes a lot of reflecting.

:

01:21:44,863 --> 01:21:46,452

Takes a lot of, uh.

:

01:21:49,827 --> 01:21:57,028

I constantly remind myself like I need to

continue being a student and learning and

:

01:21:59,788 --> 01:22:01,198

evolving and growing.

:

01:22:01,498 --> 01:22:04,798

I find a lot of help in the relationships.

:

01:22:04,798 --> 01:22:10,918

I have have some really great

conversations with friends and family, and

:

01:22:15,478 --> 01:22:16,948

it sort of helps me.

:

01:22:23,048 --> 01:22:31,118

It's validating in a lot of ways and

it helps me continue to try and focus

:

01:22:31,118 --> 01:22:34,118

on myself and how I'm feeling, and

:

01:22:36,668 --> 01:22:38,618

I'm very grateful for that.

:

01:22:38,678 --> 01:22:40,778

I feel like I have a pretty

good head on my shoulders.

:

01:22:40,778 --> 01:22:41,193

I am.

:

01:22:45,532 --> 01:22:47,543

Constantly on a journey of acceptance.

:

01:22:47,573 --> 01:22:51,532

But I think I, it's helpful

to remember it is a journey.

:

01:22:51,593 --> 01:22:53,452

There isn't going to be a destination.

:

01:22:53,513 --> 01:22:55,553

I'm gonna be on this ride

for the rest of my life.

:

01:22:56,373 --> 01:23:01,863

So just be kind to

yourself and keep learning.

:

01:23:02,733 --> 01:23:09,663

That's kind of how I go about my, my,

my thoughts around health and wellness.

:

01:23:09,782 --> 01:23:10,383

How about you?

:

01:23:11,307 --> 01:23:11,577

Your turn

:

01:23:12,921 --> 01:23:13,011

Alexandra: I

:

01:23:13,107 --> 01:23:13,662

Christine: tag, your it.

:

01:23:14,300 --> 01:23:17,691

Alexandra: I think adding to that, yes,

absolutely it is a lot of, as we've

:

01:23:17,691 --> 01:23:21,501

mentioned repeatedly throughout this

episode, trial and error, figuring out

:

01:23:21,501 --> 01:23:25,581

what does work for you and sometimes

as listening to the, the trends or

:

01:23:25,581 --> 01:23:27,711

the fads and seeing if it works.

:

01:23:27,791 --> 01:23:29,111

If it doesn't, that's okay too.

:

01:23:33,311 --> 01:23:34,751

There are two thoughts

running around in my head.

:

01:23:35,861 --> 01:23:39,821

Christine, you mentioned earlier in

one of the data and statistics about

:

01:23:40,251 --> 01:23:44,781

people at normal considered weights

kind of exhibiting dieting behaviors.

:

01:23:45,061 --> 01:23:49,800

And I think that's, there's just such a

prevalence around about weight and weight

:

01:23:49,800 --> 01:23:52,561

loss and dieting often to get to some.

:

01:23:54,331 --> 01:23:55,381

body or whatever.

:

01:23:55,681 --> 01:23:58,800

But for whatever reason, if it's

just you wanna be a little bit

:

01:23:58,800 --> 01:24:03,111

healthier, you need to, for health

concerns, you need to lose weight.

:

01:24:03,161 --> 01:24:03,761

That's awesome.

:

01:24:04,061 --> 01:24:04,661

What you need to do.

:

01:24:04,661 --> 01:24:07,421

And I think part of that

is figuring out why.

:

01:24:07,541 --> 01:24:12,881

And I was listening to, uh, one of

the first season, the first season

:

01:24:12,881 --> 01:24:18,751

of a diary of a CEO and Steven Bar,

uh, is it Bartlett was talking about

:

01:24:18,851 --> 01:24:21,461

he wanted to go to the gym and he

just couldn't get to go to the gym.

:

01:24:21,461 --> 01:24:26,641

And, he was talking about why,

which made me think of Simon.

:

01:24:26,641 --> 01:24:28,561

Simon Sinex, start with y.

:

01:24:29,152 --> 01:24:29,422

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:24:32,941 --> 01:24:37,381

Alexandra: defining healthy for

you, in my opinion, starts with

:

01:24:37,981 --> 01:24:43,741

defining what you think health is,

what health is for you the sense of.

:

01:24:44,550 --> 01:24:45,421

why you're doing it.

:

01:24:45,651 --> 01:24:51,771

If you're like, well, I wanna

look like Jane on social media,

:

01:24:57,831 --> 01:24:59,211

it's probably not a good enough reason.

:

01:25:00,861 --> 01:25:02,421

It's not gonna be one that

you're gonna stick to.

:

01:25:02,661 --> 01:25:06,531

It's not gonna be something that helps

you, commit to moving your body the way

:

01:25:06,531 --> 01:25:08,601

you said you're gonna move it every day.

:

01:25:09,711 --> 01:25:10,521

Add infinitum.

:

01:25:13,550 --> 01:25:19,941

So maybe health for somebody in

terms of fitness might be, I want to

:

01:25:20,121 --> 01:25:27,651

comfortably a mile without, you know,

my heart rate increasing dramatically.

:

01:25:28,297 --> 01:25:32,767

As simple as that's gonna get you

to phase one and maybe at some

:

01:25:32,767 --> 01:25:33,937

point when you're easily doing that.

:

01:25:34,037 --> 01:25:38,507

Your next why for health might evolve

and change, or maybe it's like you

:

01:25:38,507 --> 01:25:40,307

wanna be able to pick up your groceries

:

01:25:40,603 --> 01:25:43,093

Them all up the stairs in one

go without, you know, getting

:

01:25:43,093 --> 01:25:43,988

to the top of your going.

:

01:25:46,363 --> 01:25:49,333

I think in some ways that can be as

simple as the why we do and stick to

:

01:25:49,333 --> 01:25:54,223

something because it's very personal

to us and it'll help us find the right

:

01:25:54,253 --> 01:25:59,463

exercises, the right movements the

right way of eating for as individuals.

:

01:26:00,849 --> 01:26:05,589

What some algorithm is pushing

us and longevity, right?

:

01:26:05,589 --> 01:26:09,519

I think that was my issue

with diet culture in dieting.

:

01:26:09,669 --> 01:26:13,719

I think there's a world of difference

between eating healthily for yourself,

:

01:26:13,809 --> 01:26:17,529

eating in a way that best for your body.

:

01:26:17,619 --> 01:26:23,139

And dieting, and this is

something that I'm certainly.

:

01:26:24,259 --> 01:26:27,654

I feel like I'm navigating in my

goal to lose weight, to become my

:

01:26:27,654 --> 01:26:30,474

healthiest self without tripping

back into eating disordered habits.

:

01:26:30,474 --> 01:26:31,824

Like how do I not diet?

:

01:26:31,824 --> 01:26:35,754

How do I make lifestyle changes

that can be sustainable I

:

01:26:35,754 --> 01:26:39,124

get to what is healthy for me

:

01:26:39,635 --> 01:26:43,205

Without yo-yoing or like,

oh, I'm, I'm done dieting.

:

01:26:43,325 --> 01:26:43,615

Christine: Yeah.

:

01:26:43,854 --> 01:26:44,844

Alexandra: now I go back.

:

01:26:44,844 --> 01:26:46,074

So what's a lifestyle?

:

01:26:46,434 --> 01:26:50,334

So I, I would say that's figuring

out what's a good lifestyle, what's

:

01:26:50,434 --> 01:26:52,895

You'll commit to you'll

commit to your health.

:

01:26:54,311 --> 01:26:54,911

Christine: Absolutely.

:

01:26:56,681 --> 01:26:59,441

And I think like one of my biggest

takeaways from our conversation

:

01:26:59,441 --> 01:27:04,031

today is, and we've, we've mentioned

this multiple times, is like

:

01:27:04,211 --> 01:27:05,831

encouraging critical thinking.

:

01:27:05,831 --> 01:27:12,521

Like really thinking hard and asking

yourself the question who's truly

:

01:27:12,521 --> 01:27:14,591

benefiting from your insecurity.

:

01:27:16,290 --> 01:27:16,580

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:27:18,221 --> 01:27:24,101

Christine: Because from my view,

from my, my point on this, my, my

:

01:27:24,101 --> 01:27:28,901

view on this mountain is absolutely

no one, especially yourself.

:

01:27:29,681 --> 01:27:32,050

But I think, I think it

:

01:27:32,195 --> 01:27:35,285

Alexandra: food delivery apps

or, you know, people who,

:

01:27:36,515 --> 01:27:37,265

Christine: fine.

:

01:27:37,295 --> 01:27:38,015

Fair enough.

:

01:27:38,015 --> 01:27:39,335

But I think like,

:

01:27:44,825 --> 01:27:45,184

I think

:

01:27:48,125 --> 01:27:50,105

the moment you are your.

:

01:27:51,755 --> 01:27:58,265

Finding yourself feeding into that

insecurity, like that should be a pretty

:

01:27:58,265 --> 01:28:00,665

big, like red flag, a warning sign.

:

01:28:03,148 --> 01:28:04,109

Alexandra: So, Christine,

:

01:28:04,805 --> 01:28:05,405

Christine: Yes.

:

01:28:05,759 --> 01:28:06,389

Alexandra: prompt

:

01:28:07,115 --> 01:28:08,225

Christine: I, boy, okay.

:

01:28:09,719 --> 01:28:10,889

Alexandra: what would it look like?

:

01:28:12,239 --> 01:28:13,559

And this is also for our audience.

:

01:28:13,559 --> 01:28:16,499

I'd like everyone out there listening

to answer this for yourself as well.

:

01:28:16,499 --> 01:28:17,579

This is also for our audience.

:

01:28:17,579 --> 01:28:20,549

I'd like to take care of

yourself from a place of

:

01:28:25,690 --> 01:28:25,809

Christine: Hmm.

:

01:28:28,829 --> 01:28:29,939

Alexandra: what would it look like?

:

01:28:30,140 --> 01:28:30,300

Christine: think

:

01:28:32,309 --> 01:28:33,934

younger Christine would

:

01:28:38,285 --> 01:28:43,625

like the younger, the young kid in,

in, in all of us would feel like

:

01:28:46,505 --> 01:28:48,035

seen and protected a little bit.

:

01:28:48,255 --> 01:28:49,300

If I, if, if, if.

:

01:28:49,830 --> 01:28:54,480

If I was able to let go

of that shame growing up,

:

01:29:00,330 --> 01:29:04,200

I think it would've, I would've really,

I would really be interested to see like

:

01:29:04,590 --> 01:29:09,720

what kind of person I would be, I think,

and I think you can start that at any age.

:

01:29:09,900 --> 01:29:11,309

You can start that at any point.

:

01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:14,490

You just gotta make the

decision for yourself to

:

01:29:17,760 --> 01:29:18,720

change your mindset

:

01:29:19,254 --> 01:29:19,764

On it.

:

01:29:20,664 --> 01:29:25,374

Try and let go of the shame and

just sort of meet yourself where

:

01:29:25,374 --> 01:29:28,704

you are and ask yourself, how

do we move forward from here?

:

01:29:32,814 --> 01:29:33,894

Do you have any thoughts on that?

:

01:29:35,133 --> 01:29:35,463

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:29:35,853 --> 01:29:38,733

I think it can, would be a bit odd, right?

:

01:29:38,973 --> 01:29:42,513

Different coming from a place

of respect versus shame.

:

01:29:43,644 --> 01:29:46,394

That's not been the mo in the past.

:

01:29:48,374 --> 01:29:51,284

But I will say I feel like I have been

gradually moving towards respect in

:

01:29:51,284 --> 01:29:56,049

the sense that I find myself not giving

up on myself in a way that I used to.

:

01:29:56,559 --> 01:30:02,529

Which I feel like allows me to, to

more quickly adapt to the moments

:

01:30:03,355 --> 01:30:03,645

Christine: Yeah,

:

01:30:03,669 --> 01:30:08,049

Alexandra: this journey, um, when things

are going well and when things are not

:

01:30:08,049 --> 01:30:09,818

going well or as fast as I would like.

:

01:30:09,849 --> 01:30:13,119

So I think respect is also maturity.

:

01:30:16,645 --> 01:30:17,190

Christine: I like that.

:

01:30:17,580 --> 01:30:18,270

Absolutely.

:

01:30:19,359 --> 01:30:19,629

Alexandra: Yeah.

:

01:30:20,589 --> 01:30:24,939

So any last thoughts before we

we wrap up today's conversation?

:

01:30:25,995 --> 01:30:30,135

Christine: I just wanna send a big

thank you out there to those who are

:

01:30:30,135 --> 01:30:34,845

listening and to you, my dear for

having this conversation with me today.

:

01:30:34,845 --> 01:30:40,635

It's certainly one I've been, uh, very

excited to talk about, and I'm interested

:

01:30:40,635 --> 01:30:46,065

to see what other conversations sort

of stem from this in the future.

:

01:30:46,095 --> 01:30:47,835

So thanks everyone for being here.

:

01:30:49,419 --> 01:30:52,089

Alexandra: Okay, everyone

take a big, deep breath.

:

01:30:53,859 --> 01:30:56,019

That was a lot, wasn't it?

:

01:30:56,859 --> 01:31:00,369

If your brain feels a little bit like

it just ran a half marathon through

:

01:31:00,369 --> 01:31:04,359

a health food aisle and a therapy

session, we'll, same here for us.

:

01:31:05,325 --> 01:31:05,355

Christine: Oh.

:

01:31:06,159 --> 01:31:08,529

Alexandra: But seriously, thank

you for hanging out with us through

:

01:31:08,529 --> 01:31:11,648

this big, messy, beautifully

complicated conversation.

:

01:31:12,129 --> 01:31:15,429

We've unpacked a lot from green

juices and gut gummies to toxic

:

01:31:15,429 --> 01:31:17,529

positivity and TikTok Food Diaries.

:

01:31:18,429 --> 01:31:21,669

if you're walking away feeling

like health is more layered than

:

01:31:21,669 --> 01:31:25,749

your favorite smoothie bowl, That

means you're thinking critically,

:

01:31:25,929 --> 01:31:27,309

and that's a muscle worth flexing.

:

01:31:28,029 --> 01:31:31,179

The truth is that there's no one

size fits all when it comes to

:

01:31:31,179 --> 01:31:32,679

wellness, and there never will be.

:

01:31:33,129 --> 01:31:34,148

Health is personal.

:

01:31:34,239 --> 01:31:35,139

It is evolving.

:

01:31:35,349 --> 01:31:36,398

It's not an aesthetic.

:

01:31:36,789 --> 01:31:40,599

It's how you feel in your skin,

in your mind, in your life.

:

01:31:40,989 --> 01:31:43,059

And it definitely isn't

up to an algorithm.

:

01:31:43,869 --> 01:31:46,898

So maybe the next time you see

someone chug and celery juice, while

:

01:31:46,898 --> 01:31:51,489

doing yoga on a yacht, take a deep

breath and ask, is this helping me

:

01:31:51,759 --> 01:31:53,349

or is it just selling me something?

:

01:31:54,099 --> 01:31:57,009

then go do whatever version of self.

:

01:31:57,189 --> 01:32:00,159

And then go do whatever

version of self-care.

:

01:32:01,479 --> 01:32:02,679

Geez, I cannot read,

:

01:32:04,779 --> 01:32:08,469

and then go do whatever your

version of self-care looks like,

:

01:32:08,859 --> 01:32:12,579

whether it's a workout, a nap, or

ignoring your phone for a full hour.

:

01:32:12,789 --> 01:32:17,199

While we know before you go,

here's your gentle reminder.

:

01:32:17,409 --> 01:32:20,019

You don't have to earn your

worth by looking a certain way.

:

01:32:20,229 --> 01:32:24,009

You are already enough as you

are and as you are becoming.

:

01:32:29,919 --> 01:32:32,079

Alright, that's it for today's episode.

:

01:32:32,289 --> 01:32:36,519

If this sparks something in you, or even

just made you raise an eyebrow, go ahead

:

01:32:36,519 --> 01:32:37,779

and share it with someone you love.

:

01:32:38,199 --> 01:32:40,898

And hey, leave a review if

you're feeling extra generous.

:

01:32:41,019 --> 01:32:43,179

We'll be back next week with

our first guest of the year.

:

01:32:43,389 --> 01:32:47,559

Until then, take care of yourself

like someone you actually like.

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About the Podcast

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About your hosts

Profile picture for Christine Borowsky

Christine Borowsky

Introducing our enchanting co-host Christine, a nostalgic soul with a creative spark and an infectious optimism. A devourer of books, a music aficionado, and a film buff, she's immersed in the art of storytelling. Nature is her sanctuary, from forests to oceans. Eager for adventure, she's a perpetual learner, finding growth in every experience. Family and friends provide her comfort and joy. Unafraid of uncomfortable conversations, she navigates them with humor, believing they're vital for understanding and growth. Join her and Alexandra on this podcast where creativity meets curiosity, and laughter blends with wisdom.
Profile picture for Alexandra Montross

Alexandra Montross

Meet Alexandra, the spirited co-host of this captivating podcast, where everyday topics transform into enchanting conversations. With an old soul and a knack for the eclectic, she weaves a unique blend of organization and quirky charm into each discussion. Alexandra's passions span from wellness to metaphysics and dive into the thrilling world of entrepreneurship. Tune in for her lively perspective and insightful takes, adding a touch of magic to every episode alongside Christine. Get ready for a journey where Alexandra's vibrant energy and depth of knowledge create an unforgettable podcast experience.